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ICCS time to join the 20th century

 
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Pillar of the Community
United States
732 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2018  12:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bosox to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think the dealers also do not want ICCS to go out of business because of the amount of ICCS inventory they are sitting on. They seem pretty codependent upon each other. I still see collectors moving the good stuff steadily into PCGS holders.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
525 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2018  1:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Alex A to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
To be honest, the biggest impediment to PCGS and NGC for me is the fact they don't have a Canadian presence. I ship too much stuff across the border and understand the arbitrary and capricious habits of customs agents on both sides too well to risk the attribution of duties and taxes on items that are bought and paid for here in Canada and will be returning.

If either PCGS or NGC were to open a Canadian facility, or offer a Canadian bonded address for shipping, ICCS would be dust in months for the reasons listed above.





Well there is also another model from a different hobby - comic books! Comic books stores that sell graded comics also provide grading submission to the two major grading services. The store helps you select which comics are suitable for grading and then handles batch submissions typically 1-2 times per month. Benefit for the dealer: the service drives traffic to their store and likely results in higher sales. Benefit for the collector: easy peasy.

I can see this model working for any hobby. So food for thought...
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Canada
8104 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2018  1:55 pm  Show Profile   Check SPP-Ottawa's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add SPP-Ottawa to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There are a number of dealers in Canada that are PCGS and NGC Affiliates... for me, based in Ottawa, I use Alliance Coin & Banknote in Almonte for PCGS submissions and The Coin Hunter in Brockville for NGC submissions.
"Research is what I am doing, when I don't know what I am doing" --Wernher von Braun

Content of this post is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 3.0 Unported License. See: http://creativecommons.org/licenses...0/deed.en_US

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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1288 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2018  2:42 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add papeldog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I agree with others on the fact that your coins leave the Country for all grading companies but ICCS and CCCS and this brings on other issues.

I personally like the PCGS slabs for my higher graded coins and my varieties for appearance, protection, grading skills they seem more professional to me out of them all.

The only thing I don't really care for is the hassle that we (Canadians) sending coins down across the boarder get when it comes to customs both sides and your shipper you have picked. It seems like they add a lot of stress to the person sending the order the shippers are not very experienced with customs proper paper work usually done wrong then customs hold your coins until you do the proper paper work but no one will guide you to the forms. My last order took 15 days with customs because of improper paper work by FedEx. I wish there was someone in the west that would take orders for PCGS I would use them. All the dealers listed by PCGS for Western Canada that you can submit coins for PCGS to grade that I talked to refuse to do it said its to much hassle
Edited by papeldog
05/23/2018 3:14 pm
Pillar of the Community
Canada
2107 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2018  4:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add doubleeagle59 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sending coins from Canada to PCGS and NGC is a pain for sure.

I send them expresspost and it only takes three days to get there.

Coming back, it's the US TPG's concern, not mine.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
525 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2018  4:44 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Alex A to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks SPP-Ottawa - I missed those on the PCGS website.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1415 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2018  4:52 pm  Show Profile   Check TheCoinHunter's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add TheCoinHunter to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This is a cut and paste from the other thread but I thought it would be relevant here...

I can't speak for PCGS but my conversations with NGC on the possibilities of doing something in the Canadian market resulted in looking at current submission statistics that just wouldn't support anything beyond the current setup of self submissions or through the dealer network. We looked at a similar scenario that NGC has setup in the EU with Heritage. The idea was to try to limit the risk and cost of shipping cross border via some sort of a centralized Canadian repository with consolidated shipping. The reality is that what was on the table wouldn't be any different than an NGC (or PCGS) dealer wouldn't be able to do on their own.
Valued Member
Canada
216 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2018  5:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add vonigohcr to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@doubleeagle59


Quote:

Coming back, it's the US TPG's concern, not mine.


Until you get the call to pay brokerage fees, taxes and duties on items you already own and sent out of the country but have to pay to reclaim from UPS, FedEx or Canada Post. For some items you may have already paid fees, taxes and duties when you bought the coin initially. Remember, the duty free limit at the Canadian border is $20. Not a lot worth grading falls below that value.
Edited by vonigohcr
05/23/2018 5:34 pm
Pillar of the Community
United States
2062 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2018  7:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add okiecoiner to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It still makes my head spin to even think about folks that send less than top end material across the border to any TPG .. what a hassle and what a cost. Why do you do it? I have thousands and thousands of Vicky cents and not a single one cert'd. Why do you need someone else's OK? I can see bosox doing it and a few others on here, but why the rest of you?
Valued Member
Canada
285 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2018  7:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add trimble to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Why send them? I think to each of us our personal collections are precious even if we can't afford 65s & 66s. Its nice to have a few 'gems' in hard slabs. :)
Pillar of the Community
Canada
2107 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2018  8:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add doubleeagle59 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Until you get the call to pay brokerage fees, taxes and duties on items you already own and sent out of the country but have to pay to reclaim from UPS, FedEx or Canada Post. For some items you may have already paid fees, taxes and duties when you bought the coin initially. Remember, the duty free limit at the Canadian border is $20. Not a lot worth grading falls below that value.


This is never a problem with NGC or PCGS.

They have their own private insurance and declare '0' for the value.

Bedrock of the Community
United States
11065 Posts
 Posted 05/24/2018  12:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:

I can't speak for PCGS but my conversations with NGC on the possibilities of doing something in the Canadian market resulted in looking at current submission statistics that just wouldn't support anything beyond the current setup of self submissions or through the dealer network. We looked at a similar scenario that NGC has setup in the EU with Heritage. The idea was to try to limit the risk and cost of shipping cross border via some sort of a centralized Canadian repository with consolidated shipping. The reality is that what was on the table wouldn't be any different than an NGC (or PCGS) dealer wouldn't be able to do on their own.


The other problem is that any office in Canada would be solely dependent on Canadian submissions for revenue. There's no reason an international submission would go to that office like almost all of the other offices get along with the domestic shipments.

What you guys probably could be successful at though is getting them to start coming to some of the bigger Canadian shows and at least accept submissions on site if enough collectors and/or dealers start requesting them too.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
2086 Posts
 Posted 05/24/2018  12:17 am  Show Profile   Check Wade's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Wade to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The reality is that what was on the table wouldn't be any different than an NGC (or PCGS) dealer wouldn't be able to do on their own.


except, as stated previously, there may be some resistance for dealers to do so because of the hassle involved.

i honestly wish CCCS would buy out ICCS and become a dominant force in the canadian market. hard holders (although cccs could use an upgrade in design) and a web presence for the win
Edited by Wade
05/24/2018 12:19 am
Pillar of the Community
Canada
2107 Posts
 Posted 05/24/2018  06:54 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add doubleeagle59 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
i honestly wish CCCS would buy out ICCS and become a dominant force in the canadian market. hard holders (although cccs could use an upgrade in design) and a web presence for the win


CCCS's time has come and gone.

They had a chance to take over ICCS when they first opened, but the Canadian collector chose ICCS.

A hard holder and a computer base does not make a coin grading company the preferred choice.

ICCS's history of having a strong reputation for coin grading is the key (even with their faults, but every company has their strong and weak points).

Maybe what you should wish for is for ICCS to adopt a hard case and a computer system but unfortunately, that will never happen.
Edited by doubleeagle59
05/24/2018 06:56 am
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1415 Posts
 Posted 05/24/2018  10:25 am  Show Profile   Check TheCoinHunter's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add TheCoinHunter to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
What you guys probably could be successful at though is getting them to start coming to some of the bigger Canadian shows and at least accept submissions on site if enough collectors and/or dealers start requesting them too.


That's been discussed and there is some interest in doing that.


Quote:
The other problem is that any office in Canada would be solely dependent on Canadian submissions for revenue. There's no reason an international submission would go to that office like almost all of the other offices get along with the domestic shipments.


This is especially true because the Canadian market is very Canadian Coin centric. Although there is some foreign coin interest in Canada it is far greater in the US (per capita).
Edited by TheCoinHunter
05/24/2018 10:28 am
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