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Sales Tax. Is Vcoins Doing This As Ebay Has Made A Major Independent Move.

 
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 Posted 01/05/2019  5:59 pm Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this topic Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I was sending an invoice to a buyer. My normal $2 shipping for a 22 dollar ancient coin about. But the buyer was being charged 8.9% sales tax independent of my shipping and not asked for by me. OK eBay is doing something. I saw just two dollars added for shipping after I sent the invoice. So I almost missed it. But I also saw on the invoice before I sent it that there was a grayed out box that showed 8.9% for Washington State was being collected. Next to it a "?" and when I hovered over it I saw it said, "We're collecting this sales tax in accordance with applicable state law. You don't have to collect it and pay it to the state.". Wow, quite a powerful state up there in the Northwest as this is a first and eBay must be sending a fortune to the local state government. Really I can't erase or stop this charge and I never see the money. Is VCOINS going to have to do this as well?
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 Posted 01/05/2019  6:05 pm  Show Profile   Check echizento's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I noticed the sales tax and was surprised to see it.
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 Posted 01/05/2019  6:19 pm  Show Profile   Check Pacificoin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Pacificoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There is NO sales Tax on COINS in WA state .
Just got a letter from another dealer saying that ICTA is taking this to a federal level .
Seems that EBAY is ignoring the different State exemptions.
Etsy on the other hand is honouring them .
We just sold an ETSY offer to Seattle , no tax!


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 Posted 01/05/2019  6:45 pm  Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Pacificoin:
So ancient coins are not artifacts, they are true coins but eBay is ignoring that. A lot of money will be going to lawyers apparently to make this correct if ever. In the mean time, to quote the ICTA note you reference: (I think I saw similar or the same)...
---->eBay has announced that it will start to collect sales tax on behalf of sellers for items shipped to customers in Alabama (Jul 1), Connecticut (Apr 1), Iowa (Feb 1), Minnesota (Jan 1), New Jersey (May 1), Oklahoma (Jul 1), Pennsylvania (Jul 1), and Washington (Jan 1). Additional states will be added later.<-----
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 Posted 01/06/2019  7:42 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kushanshah to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Under the "shipping and handling" tab, Ebay now states that sales tax may apply in Washington and Minnesota (in addition to seller's home state).

VCoins is an insignificant company in terms of potential sales tax revenue. It seems unlikely that state attorneys general would find it worthwhile to target them. Ebay, on the other hand, is a potential sales tax goldmine. That being said, the day is coming (sooner rather than later) when appropriate state sales tax will be collected on all online sales. It's just a matter of how long it will take congress, the states and online platforms to hammer out the details.
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 Posted 01/06/2019  8:15 pm  Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Kushanshah;

So here is the real question. Did eBay "have" to do this? Could they have relied on all the sellers individually keeping track of each states particular law and sending state sales tax to Washington State for example? If the answer is yes, or they would have been sued for ignoring the law it then I do understand. eBay is bound by a code of ethics to respect United States laws no question. So the next question is will VCOINS feel they have a Code of Ethics to follow the laws of the United States of America? Clearly by now the people running VCOINS must be aware of this situation as they are part of this community.

By the way, each auction of mine has this first in the listing in red:
--->"Important Notice About All Auctions 2019:
EBay has announced that it will collect sales tax on behalf of sellers for items shipped to
customers in Alabama (Jul 1), Connecticut (Apr 1), Iowa (Feb 1), Minnesota (Jan 1), New
Jersey (May 1), Oklahoma (Jul 1), Pennsylvania (Jul 1), and Washington (Jan 1).
Additional states will be added later. If you live in any of the affected states you will see
a sales tax applied to your invoice and as a seller I will not see this number in my sales log.
Example: A coin sells for $20. I charge $2 Shipping. I see $22 Paid. You however see an
additional $1.72 you paid if you live in Washington State. Only bid if you accept these
conditions please as I can't refund you tax paid to your state and hopefully your services
you enjoy will be enhanced by the added revenue your state is receiving. You should have
better roads and schools for example and your local elected officials apparently
feel you should contribute to this with an online consumer tax. I am sorry and I recognize
this hurts my business but I can't change it."<---
Edited by louisvillekyshop
01/06/2019 8:22 pm
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 Posted 01/06/2019  8:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kushanshah to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
In my experience, the words "Ebay" and "ethics" should never be used in the same sentence unless the intent is to imply irony. If Ebay spends money on implementation and infrastructure, it is only because it sees it as cost effective in the long run. I think it is safe to assume that those states mentioned have applied pressure in some form.

I have no idea about VCoins but I doubt most state taxing authorities even realize it exists.

As good ethical citizens, I assume that all Ebay customers are already reporting and paying any sales tax due on out-of-state purchases as their own state law requires and that all Ebay sellers are already collecting sales tax for in-state transactions as may be required by state law.

Edited by Kushanshah
01/06/2019 9:37 pm
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 Posted 01/06/2019  9:16 pm  Show Profile   Check echizento's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I haven't really paid much attention to sales tax only because I do most of my buying on line. So I see know thatI going to have to pay more attention. Correct me if I'm wrong, but shouldn't the sales tax apply to the state where the coin was bought? I live in WA state which I found out has a sale tax of 6.5% up to 10% figure that out, now if I buy a coin that was sold in Kentucky which has a sales tax of 6% shouldn't that states sale tax apply to that sale and not WA states?
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 Posted 01/06/2019  9:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kushanshah to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@echizento Legally, the sale occurs in the state where the item is delivered. Thus, a seller based in Kentucky is only required to collect sales tax for items delivered to a Kentucky address.

I see via google that Washington state implemented a new law on 10/1/2018 which may explain why Ebay is now collecting Washington sales tax:

https://dor.wa.gov/doing-business/b...e-businesses

"Effective October 1, 2018, out-of-state businesses without a physical presence in Washington have substantial nexus with the state if they exceed $100,000 in annual retail sales to or 200 transactions with Washington consumers in the current or preceding year. Businesses who meet either threshold must register their business with the State, and collect and submit retail sales tax on their sales delivered to customers in Washington."

I can see where such a law might meet a vigorous legal challenge, as mentioned previously.
Edited by Kushanshah
01/06/2019 10:18 pm
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 Posted 01/06/2019  10:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I just made a sale to a WA customer and completely missed this.

I do see on the Order Details the ebay statement about collecting sales tax where required by law, but I could not turn up evidence of an amount they tried to collect om this transaction.

I do agree with kushanshah that it's only a matter of time for this to show up everywhere.
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 Posted 01/06/2019  11:02 pm  Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
tdziemia;

Only when you physically send the invoice do you have a chance to see the grayed out sales tax box showing what the buyer is seeing. Otherwise you have no record this was charged and are left to wonder what the buyer is talking about if they just paid without you sending an invoice separately. Here is how it looks again only when you send an invoice:
Subtotal: $XX.XX
Shipping and handling via USPS First Class Package: $X.XX
WA Sales tax: $X.XX
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 Posted 01/07/2019  07:03 am  Show Profile   Check jdmern's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add jdmern to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It is extraordinarily frustrating that they are ignoring individual state exemptions. They are soon set to begin applying it across the board in my home state of CT, where there is a state exemption on coins.
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 Posted 01/07/2019  10:15 am  Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
jdmern;

All online sales into your state will be taxed and eBay USA will do this automatically. OK, but I always spend the extra 10 cents a listing to also list in eBay UK. And when you look at one of my listings from that portal there is no mention of state sales tax in the shipping section. And there are how many eBay country specific sites? I suspect buyers from states like Washington will just hunt for more and more Chinese sites or foreign sites etc not doing this and it will take many years for the system to find a way to collect on all online sales. Now if PayPal collected there would be a money maker as most people don't want to try a new banking system and trust PayPal. I find it interesting they did not because if you make the case PayPal does not actually sell anything so they are not the vendor who has to collect, is it not also true eBay does not actually sell anything so they are not the vendor to collect from?
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 Posted 01/07/2019  12:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Alpha2814 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The bit about "...if they exceed $100,000 in annual retail sales to or 200 transactions..." looks like such a mess, especially if they preemptively withhold the tax. This early in the year, a good number of sellers may not know whether it will apply one way or the other for a long time. Smaller sellers probably won't hit it at all. Larger sellers who stop selling abruptly mid-year could be left hanging, having paid tax incorrectly.

Doing the math, $100k or 200 transactions? To be equivalent, that would be $50 each. Sell a bunch of common-date silver Roosevelt dimes individually? Tax. Sell just your PR55 1879 $4 Stella? No tax. Not that I'd want to pay sales tax for a Stella, and California exempts tax on coin sales over $1500 anyway, but it puts a lot of extra burden (or rather, relieves burden) where it doesn't necessarily belong.

Should have been all or nothing.
Working on: Peace dollars (two to go), US type (early Bust era), Indian quarter eagles, Chinese pandas, and San Francisco tokens.

"Fear is the enemy of will. Will is what makes you take action; fear is what stops you, and makes you weak."
-- Sinestro to (my avatar) Hal Jordan, "Green Lantern" (2011)
Edited by Alpha2814
01/07/2019 12:05 pm
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 Posted 01/07/2019  12:12 pm  Show Profile   Check jdmern's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add jdmern to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have no issue whatsoever with eBay following the law in taxing states where the law requires the tax to be paid.

However, eBay carte blanche applying taxes that don't exist on certain items is foolish to me both as a buyer and seller.

Many states have different levels of taxation based on what type of product an item is. A good example of this is the excise taxes applied to cigarettes, which are taxed at an entirely different rate than a loaf of bread. What eBay is doing is akin to 7/11 saying 'well we sell both cigarettes and loaves of bread, so we are going to charge taxes based off of the cigarette rate.'
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 Posted 01/07/2019  5:36 pm  Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Alpha2814

I read that $100,000 rule as the site sold over $100,000 to Washington state in the past year. The eBay general site has done this, not any individual dealer. So eBay is being treated as the vendor who is selling, not the sellers. If you look back to just 2017 posts on the eBay community there were people swearing up and down eBay would never collect taxes as they are just a platform not the vendor. And all those posts were wrong, I just work for eBay they are the vendor. I am working in their shop. So if I sell an item someone got hurt with etc it is eBay's deep pockets and I am off the hook?
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