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New Here. Is This Nero Coin Genuine? Please Advise

 
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New Member

United Kingdom
5 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  4:09 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Ancientness to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Hi
I'm new here. I got a lot of coins a few months ago. This NERO one is the only coin I find questionable of its authenticity. Ironically it was one of the more expensive I won in a bid on eBay.
The seller sells a constant flow of old coins, rings, and other artifacts all with many bidders.
This coin was described as an extremely rare ancient Roman Sestertius Nero .24,0 GR 33mm.
Please check out the attached pic, if any experts here can tell me if the coin is genuine? The seller speaks limited English and although he replaced a missing coin from the batch I purchased, he had not replied to my question about this coin as it has passed the point of returns in any case.
The coin just seems to feel a little too smooth, "too perfect" as my friend said questioning it. However there certainly was many bidders interested in it and I assume the majority of bidders on this ebay sellers page know their coins. All the Nero coins I've checked online seem to vary a lot. I've found one of a similar design but not the same either.
Thanks

Edited by Ancientness
05/06/2019 9:39 pm
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United States
73250 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  4:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
to the Community!

Your post was moved to the appropriate forum for the proper attention.
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United States
22403 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  5:31 pm  Show Profile   Check echizento's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
to the community

The coin is Claudius not Nero and would be a valuable example in this condition. IMO it looks too good to be a genuine example. I'm sure our Roman collectors will be along to comment. I hope I'm wrong and it turns out to be genuine.
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Russian Federation
2650 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  6:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add january1may to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am about 90% sure that this is fake. Really don't like the look of the lettering. I would not have bought it if it was sold individually.

That said, I'm very far from an expert, and it's possible (though unlikely) that this coin is in fact real.
New Member
United Kingdom
5 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  7:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ancientness to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi,
Thanks for the welcomes.
Wow I didn't realise it was a Claudius coin but you're absolutely right. I searched it and could not find the same coin but I found some pretty close. However I also agree I believe ths particular coin is a fake. Compared to the others it is just too perfect and smooth - especially the near perfect roundness and smooth edges. The fake also just looks brand new stamped like no wear at all.
I've attached some photos below of the best matches I could find. The nearest I found looks to be what this forgery was based on - only missing the little studs around its outside.
I also found someone posted a pic of their fake Claudius coin and the smoothness of the metal seems to be just like my one. There's a sort of oily glossed look to it.
If someone can show me evidence that proves this is fake I'm sure I can get a refund as it was listed as a "Nero" coin and turned out to be a fake Claudius... lol







Pillar of the Community
United States
678 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  7:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kushanshah to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The high points should be worn with crispness remaining in the recesses. This coin has an overall soapy softness typical of cast fakes. One would expect a genuine example of this type in similar condition to sell somewhere north of $1000, even on eBay. The price you paid is a red flag in its own right.
Edited by Kushanshah
05/06/2019 7:44 pm
Bedrock of the Community
Australia
15545 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  7:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would like to see an independently provable provenance for this coin.

I am not happy with the style of the die cutting on the reverse, it is out of character with other sestertii of Nero that I have reviewed on Vcoins.

If it is a modern fake (and I think thus far, that it is), it should XRF test as a discreet controlled alloy of brass, (copper and zinc only).
The ancients could not refine copper as well as in modern times, and as a result a modern alloy would be devoid of a wide variety of the trace elements that may be found in the alloy of a Roman sestertius.
The Roman term for a brass alloy of copper and zinc is 'orichalcum'.

I agree with the comments that the surfaces look (and probably feel) 'greasy'. This often indicates (but not always) that suspect sestertius is fake.
Edited by sel_69l
05/06/2019 7:56 pm
Pillar of the Community
United States
678 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  7:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kushanshah to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
See https://www.ebay.com/itm/254122793972. This seller's inventory is in my opinion almost entirely ridiculous fakes. Everything sells at pennies on the pound vs genuine items. Caveat emptor. "Sold" listings:https://www.ebay.com/sch/ancientear...=1&LH_Sold=1
Edited by Kushanshah
05/06/2019 8:03 pm
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United States
4261 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  7:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bob L to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Perhaps a match? From the fake reports:

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Australia
15545 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  8:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It is probable in this case, that the seller can't honestly be really sure if the coin is genuine or not.

'Caveat Emptor' becomes critical. Just attempt to sell it, in the hope that it may indeed be genuine.

I would pass on this one.
Pillar of the Community
United States
678 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  8:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kushanshah to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The seller of this coin ancientearth2006 is on Forvm's "Notorious Fake Sellers List".
Edited by Kushanshah
05/06/2019 8:13 pm
New Member
United Kingdom
5 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  9:13 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ancientness to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wow thanks everyone for all the information!
The legitimacy of this seller has been puzzling...
On the one hand this coin is clearly fake, but on the other hand the silver coins I bought, some more expensive - I have tested with my special silver test magnet and it slides down them slowly just as it would real silver which I am guessing means at least the silver is real. The other thing that confuses me is this sellers listings consist of various quality types of items. For example a bunch of "ancient crusade coins" I bought do have a battered and rusty look about them. A Cleopatra miniature statue thing had its face completely eroded away. My thinking was that the seller sold items starting bid at 0:99 because the listings are in bulk and continuous. I assumed the seller must have some connections to a large mass of these items. Maybe that was naive of me to think that...

In total I spent several hundreds on this sellers items :S - I was thinking I was winning great deals because the bids were always buzzing.

When I received the coins I checked to make sure they were all there and found one was not matching the purchase - a "Greek bronze" one. The seller sent me another 4 to replace this one. The seller also states below each listing that buyers can return the coins for any reason within one month.

I suppose the "any reason" part should have raised my eyebrow...

This one month return policy is also what made me think the seller must be legit.

Here is the other items I bought... I was hoping only this Claudius coin was fake and the rest could be real, however I see as Kushanshah has pointed out this seller is listed on Forvm's "Notorious Fake Sellers List" (I didn't know of this list until now!)
So I'm guessing I got robbed for a pile of junk?



















Edited by Ancientness
05/06/2019 9:44 pm
New Member
United Kingdom
5 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  9:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ancientness to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If this ring is fake it's the most disappointing :/


Pillar of the Community
United States
678 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  9:42 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kushanshah to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Nothing suspicious about the return policy. That's an industry standard practice. In my opinion, the "Indo-Greek" (Kushan), Byzantine, Islamic, Crusader bulk lot and Greek bronzes are likely genuine. Most of the silver and the rings are certainly fake. This is a common pattern on eBay. We've all learned expensive lessons along the way. I hope this will not dissuade you from your interest in ancient coins.
Edited by Kushanshah
05/06/2019 9:48 pm
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United States
22403 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  9:45 pm  Show Profile   Check echizento's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There is a mixture of both genuine and fake coins that you bought. The Kushan coins all appear genuine while most of the silver coins are fakes. The rings are also fakes. Sorry to have to tell you this.
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United States
11936 Posts
 Posted 05/06/2019  9:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@ancientness, first welcome to CCF. Second, I was bummed to read through this thread and see that are have not gotten started off on the right foot. I wouldn't recommend purchasing these sorts of coins off of ebay, although I do note that there are some very good sellers there too. You will see a sticky thread on this part of the forum with recommended and not recommended sellers of ancient coins. Consider working with someone from the former rather than the latter. Finally, for some of the coins which do appear to be real in your collection, if you would like some help with the identification process, please feel free to start a new thread and post them here. We love a challenge!
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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