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Today's Challenge Coin: Greek Silver, 11.5mm, 0.70 Grams

 
 
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 Posted 07/16/2019  4:54 pm Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this topic Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I took the side with more detail in 4 orientations and the reverse is just one orientation. I'll go first: lion's tail and back of lion? (Hope I don't bias you folks as I really have no idea so shoot that right down if you see anything else. And if this is easy please forgive my missing the obvious.)





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 Posted 07/16/2019  6:07 pm  Show Profile   Check FVRIVS RVFVS's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add FVRIVS RVFVS to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I hope this isn't supposed to be some sort of Freudian Rorschach test ......

Q) Doctor says "what do you see" ?
A) A man and woman ......
Q) Now what ?
A) A man and woman ......
Q) And now ?
A) A man and woman ......

Doctor - Aha ! I believe you have an obsession with sex !

Patient - But you're the one showing me the dirty pictures !
IN GOD WE TRVST ....... all others pay cash !

COGITO ERGO SPVD
I think ...... therefore I yam
Edited by FVRIVS RVFVS
07/16/2019 6:10 pm
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 Posted 07/16/2019  7:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Could side 1 be a ram's head? Just spit-balling...
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 Posted 07/16/2019  8:21 pm  Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well do you agree these seem to be man made images that I can't figure out? That looks like details that are visible and man made not some artifact and thus random curved line for example. It has to be some kind of obol, and there were some odd combinations of swans and salamanders etc that if you were only looking at a part of the image it would seem impossible. There seems to be some very raised image visible, especially that straight line that curves at the end.
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 Posted 07/16/2019  8:46 pm  Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I can kind of see a ram's head in the first direction but the second photo of the two below makes me think it is not. That second photo might be the most important if this is ever figured out. Captures even the damage on a raised area, so a gouge in the silver.


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 Posted 07/16/2019  8:54 pm  Show Profile   Check echizento's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Bob is real good at spotting detail that most of us miss, he might have and idea what it is, I sure don't.
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 Posted 07/17/2019  09:36 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bob L to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
he might have and idea what it is


Nope, not this time.

To pin this down you'd have to account for the shapes, the weight, and the metal. It may be too far gone as far as the shapes go. But you'd definitely need to account for the linear element - the line to the side that is mostly straight then becomes wavy at its end and then terminates in a dot.

There is a litra of Selinos, of this approximate weight (7gm) that has a serpent on the left of the obverse that, in some specimens, is very similarly shaped. However, the other shapes on the obverse, depicting a seated nymph, don't seem to match up.

I am struck - pardon the pun - by the similarity between shapes when the OP coin is rotated and compared to some of the Eastern European imitations of Philip II's from Macedon. Zeus' nose, bulbous cheek, curving jawline, and the shape at the tip of the chin/beard - and even the pellets (for eye and upper lip - and I think I may see a vague dot for the lower lip too on the OP) align fairly well. (Examples of what I'm talking about, below) But the imitations were typically struck larger - I'm not sure if there were very small denominations of these struck. Also the line for the "nose" on the OP would protrude out really far if indeed it depicts a profile. Too far to be a nose? Could some of the oddness - the nose being out a bit far and the upper lip a bit high - simply result from the smallness of the die? The Eastern engravers were used to larger "canvases."

And so I'm left with:


Edited by Bob L
07/17/2019 09:59 am
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 Posted 07/17/2019  10:59 am  Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wow Bob that is an amazing lineup you posted and boy that looks very close for the image! Simply amazing work and at least I have a start now to look. So the back can just be the body of some stylized horse off struck badly. (If these were even stuck at this size of course.) Seriously I am floored by your comparison!
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 Posted 07/17/2019  7:42 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Strong work, even by your lofty standard on this one Bob!
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 Posted 07/18/2019  8:56 pm  Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Bob:

They do indeed exist in the obol size!



EASTERN CELTS. 2nd to 1st century BC. Obol (Silver, 10mm, 0.67 g 9), imitation of Philip II of Macedon, 'Kugelwange' Type (?). Celticized laureate head of Zeus to right. Rev. Horse galloping right. Cf. Flesche 616-618 and Lanz 502-518 (drachms and horse to left).
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 Posted 07/18/2019  8:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bob L to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply


I think we have a winner!
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 Posted 07/18/2019  9:24 pm  Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Bob;

It is especially good to see the nose was that big! Perhaps in the small flan it was just easier to draw the exaggerated features. Also, I only ask for a coin like this that I think others will find interesting and I no idea about. So that said, I might post about a great coin I am proud of and I know the ID, but these question coins where guys like you tell me an answer I'd never get I am writing on the listing I will do a one time donation to the forum for 10% of the sale price. Probably won't be much in this case but I feel in a situation like this it is the very least I can do for such amazing help!
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 Posted 07/18/2019  10:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bob L to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
writing on the listing I will do a one time donation to the forum for 10% of the sale price


Nice!
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 Posted 08/03/2019  08:36 am  Show Profile   Check louisvillekyshop's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Bob L.

Well for the two unknown coins you folks helped me with I did write in the listing I'd donate 10% to the forum. Well the sales of both went for $16.75 total, (this silver obol went $4.50) so 10% makes this $1.68, donated below. At least we know the one time donation link works well and the coins went to someone who will keep them labeled for eternity probably!

"You've donated $1.68 USD to
donations@coincommunity.com"
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 Posted 08/03/2019  09:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bob L to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Would have been nice if they went for more, given their rarity. But, nevertheless, a nice gesture on your part, Joe.
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