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My First Animal On A Coin.

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 Posted 10/15/2020  1:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bob L to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
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 Posted 10/15/2020  5:56 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Novicius to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the link Bob, but it takes me to a page that says "No image to display".
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 Posted 10/15/2020  6:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bob L to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here's a cut-and-paste.

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 Posted 10/15/2020  6:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Novicius to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This one had me really stumped, but once again you have hit the nail square on the head Bob.

That is the coin without a shadow of a doubt. Many, many thanks.

Jim
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 Posted 10/15/2020  6:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Palouche to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Nice one Bob!.....And a cool coin Jim.

Really nice scenario with the bulls head to head..
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 Posted 10/16/2020  7:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Novicius to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Cheers Paul, some of these little coins are well crafted.

The young man's head on the obverse of this little coin from Motya (modern day Mozia) has not fared well. The crab on the reverse is pretty reasonable though, considering it's age. The coin would have been minted just prior to the time of the Siege of Motya in 397 BC.

Motya was an ancient and powerful city situated on the island of San Panteleo in the Stagnone Lagoon, to the north of present day Marsala (Lilybaeum), and to the south of Trapani (Draepenum). It may have been a Phoenician trading post as early as the 11th century BC. The Phoenicians had transformed the inhospitable island into one of the most affluent cities of it's time. Salt pans were used for evaporation, and windmills were used for grinding and refining the salt. The mills and salt pans (Ettore Infersa) have recently been restored, and are open to the public.

According to Thucydides, the Phoenicians were inhabiting Sicily along all the coastlines until the Greeks began arriving in the 8th century BC, at which point the Phoenicians gradually abandoned their settlements in the immediate neighbourhood of the newcomers, and consolidated themselves in Motya, Soloeis (Soluntum), and Panormus. In common with the other Phoenician settlements in Sicily, Motya passed under the government or dependency of Carthage.

Due to its defensible position, Motya became a base of operations for the Carthaginian fleet, a stronghold of Carthaginian power on Sicily, and a prime target of Dionysius of Syracuse in 397 BC, when he sought to drive the Carthaginians from Sicily. As Dionysus marched toward Motya with a sizeable force, many formerly Greek towns that were under Carthaginian control, and some non-Greek like Eryx, defected to the Greeks. In preparation for a possible Carthaginian siege, the long causeway that connected Motya to the mainland was destroyed, forcing Dionysius to build a mound to bridge the gap when he arrived.

Motya, Segesta, and Entella were all besieged by Dionysius, but, since Motya was the stronghold of Carthaginian power, he focused his attention there with a force of 80,000 troops and a sizeable fleet to control the lagoon. The Carthaginians sent a fleet of about 100 triremes to try and relieve Motya, but due to a plague could not send more. On approaching, some Greek ships and land based siege weaponry engaged them, while another force of Greek triremes sailed around the isthmus in an attempt to attack from two sides. The Carthaginians disengaged, and sailed back to Carthage, leaving Motya facing the forces of Dionysius alone.

After a desperate struggle, and after the walls and towers were breached by the overwhelming forces of the enemy, the Motyans still maintained the defence from street to street and from house to house. This obstinate struggle infuriated the invaders, and when they became masters of the city, started indiscriminate slaughter of the inhabitants, much to the dismay of Dionysius, who ordered them to stop with no success. Dionysius then encouraged the remaining citizens of Motya to take refuge in their temples, knowing the Greek soldiers would not violate the sanctity of those seeking refuge in them. The few survivors were sold into slavery, except the Greeks who had fought with Motya; they were crucified. The town was then sacked and destroyed.

After the return of the territory to Carthaginian control, and the end of that conflict with Syracuse, the city of Motya was never rebuilt.

Sicily, Motya, Siculo-Punic issue, ca. 409 - 397 BC.
Obverse: Young male head right. Reverse: Crab. Denomination: Onkia. Bronze. Diameter: 10 mm. Weight: 1.10 gr.
SNG ANS 511.
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 Posted 10/16/2020  9:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bob L to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Another great history lesson. Thanks, Jim. Two crab reverses posted to the board tonight. What were the odds?
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 Posted 10/17/2020  5:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Palouche to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Very interesting write up!....The last paragraph shows just how brutal people can be eh!?
Nice little coin with a cool looking crab.

Don't know about you Jim but I do find it quite frustrating when the obverse portrait is described as male/female, left/right with no knowledge of who is being depicted. For sure someone was important enough, at the time of mint, to be portrayed on the coin but alas maybe these facts have been lost forever. It is something I'm quite interested in possibly a future retirement project
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 Posted 10/17/2020  8:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Novicius to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the feedback guys.

Quote:
Two crab reverses posted to the board tonight. What were the odds?

I did a double take on that as well Bob. The "coin" is in nice condition too, so it is a pity that it turned out to be a fantasy piece.

Quote:
The last paragraph shows just how brutal people can be eh!?

The blood-lust must have been running very high that day Paul. I would not like to have lived in those times!

I had been looking at a Troas Kebren Diobol, listed as "Archaic head of female", but on Wildwinds the head was listed as Apollo! With all the destruction of complete cities in those days, much of the history and the records will be gone for ever. I guess if a researcher is not completely sure of whose head is on a coin, it is safer to say a male head, or a female head, rather than be called out for it later. It would make a very interesting retirement project for sure though.

I found this coin of the Euboian (Euboean) League to be interesting, as it features a cow on the obverse instead of a bull, and two bunches of grapes on the reverse. It is said to be quite rare, and has a dark green patina which I find attractive.

A Greek island in the West Aegean Sea, Euboia (Long Island) is second in size only to Crete. Euboia is separated from the mainland of Greece by the narrow Euripus Channel, and covers an area of 3908 sq. km (1509 sq. miles). The chief cities in antiquity were Chalcis and Eretria. Other cities (there were perhaps as many as thirteen in all) included Histiaea, Geraestus, and marble-rich Carystus, and there were an astonishing number of second-order settlements. Euboia was important to Athens as source of grain and cattle.

The Euboian League was a federal league of the cities of Euboia, extant from the 3rd century BC to the 2nd or 3rd century AD. It was a full federation of city-states, with its own federal laws, and common coinage. However the member cities would continue to mint their own coins. The League is first attested during the reign of Demetrios Poliorketes (294-288 BC), but is not mentioned again until around 194 BC on. Based on it's coinage, it survived until well into the Roman Empire, possibly as late as the provincial reorganization under Diocletian (284-305 AD).

Euboia, Euboian League, 196 - 194 BC.
Magistrate DHMARXOS. Obverse: Cow recumbent to left; eight rayed star above. Reverse: ΕΥΒ(ΟEΩΝ) Two bunches of grapes on vine; star above. Bronze. Diameter: 16 mm. Weight: 3.63 gr.
Sear 2476.
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 Posted 10/19/2020  5:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Palouche to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Very nice Jim!....It cetainly is a rare coin...
Congrats and again nice write up..
Here's a link to two I found..
https://www.coinarchives.com/a/resu...a+AND_League
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 Posted 10/19/2020  6:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Novicius to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Here's a link to two I found.

There are some really nice coins on that page Paul, cheers.

I couldn't resist this one, as the horse on the reverse reminded me of the Troas horse, but it's from Larissa in Thessaly.

Gorgias the ancient Greek sophist, pre-Socratic philosopher, and rhetorician died there in 375 BC, and the "Father of Medicine", Hippocrates (Hippocrates of Kos), died there c. 370 BC aged ninety. Legend has it as the birthplace of Achilles.

Larissa was also the birthplace of Meno, one of the generals leading the ill-fated expedition of 401 BC (retold in Xenophon's Anabasis) to help Cyrus the Younger, son of Darius II, king of Persia, overthrow his elder brother Artaxerxes II, and take over the throne of Persia. Meno is featured in Plato's dialogue bearing his name, in which Socrates uses the example of "the way to Larissa" to help explain to Meno the difference between opinion and science. The "way to Larissa" might have been an attempt by Socrates to explain to Meno, that the "way home" was the way to the "eternal" home, by seeking the true path in life.

The name of Thessalian Larissa is first recorded in connection with the aristocratic Aleuadai family, and it was also a city-state. In the late 5th century Larissa ceased minting federal coins, and adopted its own coinage. Many coins depicted the nymph of the local spring, Larissa, (for whom the town was named) on the obverse, and the reverse depicted a horse in various poses. Thessaly, a land of plains, was well known for its horses.

As the chief city of ancient Thessaly, Larissa was taken by the Thebans and later directly annexed by Philip II of Macedon in 344 BC. It remained under Macedonian control apart from a brief period when Demetrius Poliorcetes captured it in 302 BC. It was in Larissa in 197 BC that Philip V of Macedon signed a treaty with the Romans after his defeat at the Battle of Cynoscephalae. In 196 BC Larissa became an ally of Rome and was the headquarters of the Thessalian League.

Larissa, Thessaly. 395-344 BC.
Obverse: Head of nymph right. Reverse: ΛAΡI-ΣAIΩN, horse standing left, about to roll. Bronze. Diameter 14 mm. Weight: 2.1 gr.
Reference: SNG Cop 143
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 Posted 10/20/2020  10:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Novicius to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This coin was listed as Egypt, Ptolemy VI, 145 - 80 BC., struck in Cyprus, and very rare. The reference given is Svoronos 843. However it appears that it may be another misattribution, and the date of 145-80 BC makes no sense.

All the Ptolemy coins I've seen with the head of Zeus show him with a mop of curly hair, while this one shows a head sporting a beard and short hair.

Searching for an eagle standing with a lotus to the left, turns up mainly Ptolemy coins, but none show the short haired bust.

Catheine C Lorber's "The Lotus Of Aphrodite On Ptolemaic Bronzes" lists all ten lotus-bearing series. In it she states that only Series VII (Svor. 1403-1408) contains coins marked only by a lotus blossom in the left field, and it lists Ptolemy VI as shortly before 170-168 BC. Series VII.6 (Svor 1408) has coins from 13-17 mm, with weights between 1.00-2.45 gr. This coin has a diameter of 14-11 mm, and weighs in at 2.77 gr. None of the illustrations show a short haired Zeus.

Svor 843 is listed as Series I, 17 mm and 2.91-5.00 gr. (Ptolemy II / Ptolemy III). I did find a Sear 7898 variety, but it is 26 mm in diameter and 15.66 grams, with long curly hair.

Can anyone help with this one?

Original Listing:
Egypt, Ptolemy VI, 145 - 80 BC.
Obverse: Head of Zeus Ammon right. Reverse: ΠΤΟΛΕΜΑΙΟΥ ΒΑΣΙΛΕΩΣ around eagle standing left with closed wings; lotus in left field. Bronze. Diameter: 14 mm. Weight: 2.77 gr. Struck in Cyprus.
Svoronos 843; Sear 7898v.
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 Posted 10/20/2020  5:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Palouche to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Interesting find Jim....
Found this one on vcoins...
https://www.vcoins.com/en/stores/ae...Default.aspx

Jim are you sure it's a lotus and not a cornucopia?...But I'm out of my depth here...Paul
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 Posted 10/20/2020  6:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Novicius to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
But I'm out of my depth here...Paul

Apparently not Paul.

With the high point of the laurel crown, the large ear, and the deep vertical groove on the neck, I'd say this was a match. I will check out the cornucopia, but I'm pretty sure it is the lotus though.

I wonder if Ms. Lorber knows about this variety? Her study was pretty intensive. The Svoronos 1716 reference was a surprise.

Thanks,
Jim
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 Posted 10/22/2020  12:50 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Novicius to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Jim are you sure it's a lotus and not a cornucopia?

I did another search for a coin with a cornucopia instead of a lotus, Paul, but once again came up with nothing. The coin in the Vcoins link you posted is the only other coin I have seen that is a close match. I checked out the Svoronos 1716 reference, but it showed coins with the head of Zeus sporting the large mop of very curly hair. We know the coin exists, but getting a proper identification is not proving to be easy.
--------------------

The eagle attracted me to this coin of Amyntas III, then I realised that he was Alexander the Great's grandfather.

Amyntas III, son of Arrhidaeus, was born in 420 BC in Pella, Macedonia, Greece. He became king of Macedon in 393 BC at the age of 27, but was driven out the same year by the Illyrians. In the following year, with the aid of the Thessalians, he recovered his kingdom. He reigned then from 392 to 370 BC.

He was husband of Gygaia, and Eurydice, queen consort of Macedonia. He had three sons by his wife Eurydice; Alexander II, Perdiccas III, and the youngest of whom was the famous Philip II of Macedon. Amyntas died at the age of 50, leaving his throne to his eldest son, Alexander II. Towards the end of his life Amyntas's position may have been threatened by Ptolemy of Alorus, said to have been the son-in-law and lover of his wife Eurydice. She planned to assassinate Amyntas, but was foiled by her daughter Eurynoe, who revealed the plan to her father.

Justin mentions that Amyntas III had three sons by his other wife, Gygaea: Archelaus, Arrhidaeus and Menelaus. They were thought to be younger than Amyntas' children by Eurydice, and were eliminated by their half-brother Philip II because they had a claim to the throne.

Amyntas III came to the throne during the disorders that plagued Macedonia after the death of the powerful king Archelaus. He soon had to fight off attacks by the Illyrians and by the Chalcidian League, a confederation of cities of the Chalcidice peninsula, east of Macedonia. The threat from the latter was removed when intervention by Sparta led to the dissolution of the league in 379 BC. Amyntas continued to maintain his independence by siding with the powers ascendant in Greece, including first Athens and then Thessaly.

His skilful diplomacy created a minor role for Macedonia in Greek affairs, and prepared the way for its emergence as a great power under his son Philip II. Philip II was the father of Alexander the Great.

Amyntas III, Kingdom of Macedonia. Tetrachalkon. 393-369 BC.
Obverse: Head of Herakles right, wearing lion's skin headdress. Reverse: Eagle standing right, attacking serpent. Reverse Inscription: AMYNTA. Aigai or Pella mint. Bronze. Diameter: 16 mm. Weight: 3.5 gr.
Reference: SNG ANS 100-9
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