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1859 Cents Wide 9/8 - Please ID Die Pairs

 
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Author Previous TopicReplies: 15 / Views: 769Next Topic  
Valued Member

Canada
468 Posts
 Posted 09/10/2020  02:15 am Show Profile   Check TerryT's eBay Listings Bookmark this topic Add TerryT to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I have 8 of these, mostly low grades from bulk lots. Would be great to be able to label them correctly.

I have 2 that seem to be the same -#1 and 1a here. They have the same obverse (die crack in R of GRA, DP-G in REG, faint circular die crack around the legend).
The reverse of both have a missing stem on leaf 9, but only one has a die crack at leaf 7, so I'm not sure if it's the same reverse ..?





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United States
827 Posts
 Posted 09/10/2020  08:31 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Phil310 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looks like Turner Obverse OG3 and reverse RD6 for both of those. Turner's book would be a good resource if you want to collect the W9/8 die pairs.

Here's the link to his website where you can get the book.

https://www.victoriancent.com/index.html

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Canada
1626 Posts
 Posted 09/10/2020  10:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add papeldog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I agree with you Phil310, RD6 reverse 9% used, OG3 obverse 2% used.
Valued Member
Canada
468 Posts
 Posted 09/10/2020  8:15 pm  Show Profile   Check TerryT's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add TerryT to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Papeldog, I'm not looking to collect the die pairs, I'm looking to know what I have. I already got mired in the Narrow 9 die pairs, yikes, with over 120 different pairs. I have way too many other coins to go off on another collecting tangent.
Between 2000 and 2010, before slabbing and dealers took over, I was always searching ebay for the varieties that others missed, at bargain basement prices, with an eye to reselling them in my retirement. Now that I'm 70 and only on government pension, I'm trying to prune my collections (it hurts to sell any of them but at least I'll know what I'm selling).




I bought books. I had Zoell cent and 5 cent books in the mid 60's, I had a Charlton 1973 until it fell apart and bought others. I had 60 1812 Tiffins; I bought the book, I have 60 or so 1823-32 N.S. thistle tokens; I bought the book. With only these 8 (probably only 6 different), I don't want to buy the book at that price. 6 of these coins cost between $1 and $6 Cdn., the two others cost $18 and $25.

So here's another pair that I think are the same, 2 and 2a. On the reverse, they have the same weak #6 vine and the same broken section on vine #7. Both have a repunched N in CAN (edit after-thought {and a different crossbar on the A of VICTORIA, than on the other A's - die clog? })
Coin 2 has doubled, heavy die clash marks on the reverse, especially above the E of ONE, and by leaf 14. Coin 2a has a die crack on leaf 7 (after seeing the photo here, I see another small crack at leaf 11).





Edited by TerryT
09/11/2020 12:36 am
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1626 Posts
 Posted 09/10/2020  10:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add papeldog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes keeping up on a coin book library can get expensive TerryT, but it gives a person the knowledge of what coins to target for better premiums like mentioned it is costly. I don't really collect the die pairs either but do purchase 1859/8 and 1858 large cents regularly and like yourself I like to ID them properly too.

Keep putting them up TerryT its fun trying to identify them

The 2a is an RD8 1% used on Reverse, - OG2 1% used on Obverse
The other one could be the same maybe others will chime in and verify them.
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United States
982 Posts
 Posted 09/11/2020  2:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bosox to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
1st (2) is OH1/RD12. 2nd (2a) is OG2/RD8. Both are reasonably scarce die pairs.
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Canada
1626 Posts
 Posted 09/11/2020  3:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add papeldog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the correction Rob nice to have the experts to chime in with corrections.

Even with the book sometimes I get it wrong its fun trying to ID them.
Valued Member
Canada
468 Posts
 Posted 09/12/2020  01:58 am  Show Profile   Check TerryT's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add TerryT to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Can you tell me what details are different in 2 and 2a ? I couldn't tell them apart. I thought that the odd crossbar of the A in VIC on both would be from the same die.

Here's a real junk lot find, a few digs and a dent, but I guess some people don't want retained lamination error coins when they're banged up. Lots of other lamination error marks in the obverse legend, more on the reverse, above ONE.
The reverse has a die crack, rim to leaf 6, and no stem on leaf 9. There's no real identifier on the obverse.


Edited by TerryT
09/12/2020 02:02 am
Valued Member
Canada
468 Posts
 Posted 09/15/2020  12:05 am  Show Profile   Check TerryT's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add TerryT to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
#4 has a repunched O in ONE. On the obverse, there's a weak die crack along the top of RATIA, and die clash in the letters under the bust. The I in VIC looks to be repunched.


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United States
827 Posts
 Posted 09/15/2020  08:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Phil310 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Look at the stem to leaf 9 on 2 and 2a. The stem to leaf 9 is an important marker for all provincial cent reverse dies (1858 and 1859) since almost all of the reverse dies had the broken stem 9 re-cut into the die by hand.

Your coin # 3 is one of those that did not have the broken stem re-cut. I think that coin is a Turner Obverse OC5 and Reverse RD6.
Valued Member
Canada
468 Posts
 Posted 09/22/2020  02:03 am  Show Profile   Check TerryT's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add TerryT to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
So far, so good for 1-2-3, might as well try another; die cracks on the obverse, before R of REG, and another on the I of VIC. There's a double-punched N in CAN. No reverse cracks.


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United States
982 Posts
 Posted 09/22/2020  6:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bosox to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Are you asking the board to attribute your entire box of W9/8 cents because you do not want to buy a book?
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Canada
3249 Posts
 Posted 09/22/2020  7:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add okiecoiner to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm with you, Rob .. he's not a newbie.
Valued Member
Canada
468 Posts
 Posted 09/24/2020  5:17 pm  Show Profile   Check TerryT's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add TerryT to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
WOW, wow....wow....
You have no idea how upset I got reading the last two posts.
WOW. I read it at 1:30 in the morning: it's now 5:15 p.m. and I still didn't sleep. I've written 20 pages in my mind. It's been eating at me all day.

Yes, Bosox, and Okie, I would like to know the ID of 8 coins, 8, yes, 8 crummy coins (that's a pretty small "entire box"), without having to lay out $70 US to ID those 8 coins. All 8 cost me about $55 Cdn. My wife and I get $1600 a month pension each - Book $70 US x 1.33= $93 Cdn.= 1 week groceries, hmm , I'll pass.

I guess pm's flew back and forth to tell everyone not to reply, so thanks to Papeldog and Phil310 for helping out.

I've been a collector/hoarder for 60 years; I only sell my extras. So far, 1 of the 9/8's is a double, that means I will be keeping 7 and eventually selling 1. I'm not planning on trying to collect the whole lot of them (out of curiosity, how many die pairs are there, oh I forgot, buy the book).
But, then, Bosox, you didn't know that I've been in a depression for the last 4 years from a family problem and don't see my grandchildren, then my 96 year-old mother died last year and I had 5 months of problems with the bank, and then Covid-19 (my hands are shaking typing this), and a car smashed into my fence, and the weeds are 5 feet tall in the yard, and I would come to this site to maintain some sense of normal, and to learn, and to help on other's questions, and I just started to get back to something like normal a few weeks ago, and all I wanted was 7 crummy ID numbers, Well, I went off for a bit and actually had a little cry thinking about all this, so thanks, I heard crying is good for you.

I am so overwhelmed with all the coins, actually everything, that I thought I could get a little help here. All I needed to finish marking all my Canadian decimals, from 1 cent to $1, Victoria to Eliz II, was my 2 1858's (which I did get ID'd thank you) and 8- 9/8's, and then I was going to ask about ID's for 7-8 difficult 1859's. That's it, decimals done, then I can see about reviewing my colonial tokens by buying the PEI colonial tokens book (which do interest me).

So Bosox and Okie, I hereby withdraw my application to the 1859 9/8 secret ID number clique and will return my coins back to the binder unidentified and never speak of them again.



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 Posted 09/24/2020  6:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add okiecoiner to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sorry for upsetting you, Terry. You and I have talked for years on different coin sites, some with my 2 old "names" on the site and never had an ill word between us. I actually thought that the request for ID'ing more of the 9/8's was from someone else, not you. I thought that it was someone else whp posts regularly and has a thick wallet... egg on my face.
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United States
982 Posts
 Posted 09/24/2020  8:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bosox to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am sorry you are having difficulties. My post was not personal, I sent no PM's or emails, and I would have said the same thing to anyone who posted a string of 1858's or W9/8 cents for attribution by the board. I have no trouble at all with people asking for help on a few hard ones. If you look above, I attributed 2 and 2a for you above, before you posted the rest.

PM your address to me and I will give you a book. Then you can ID them yourself.
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