Coin Community Family of Web Sites
Like us on Facebook! Subscribe to our Youtube Channel! Check out our Twitter! Check out our Pinterest!
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?


Welcome Guest! Need help? Got a question? Inherit some coins?
Our coin forum is completely free! Register Now!

How To Grade Coins That Did Not Start Off Well?

 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 5 / Views: 368Next Topic  
Valued Member
Canada
384 Posts
 Posted 09/26/2020  08:48 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Silver101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
One of my white whale coins is a decent 1870 Newfoundland 10c. The coin was scarce from the start with only 30,000 minted and there are obverse 1 and 2 varieties.

It appears that a great number of them were very poorly struck, particularly on the reverse. Most of the extant examples that I've been able to find are somewhere between borderline legible and illegible. For example:

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/1870-Newfou...AOSwHnxfDk6O

and

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/1870-obv-1-...AOSwQ3le9hpW

and

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/1870-scarce...AOSwkF1eyydy

Which brings me to this example which is graded AU-50 by PCGS:

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/1870-Newfou...AOSwrIdewqJS

This guy is solid but, seriously, AU-50? I'm wondering if this is more capricious behaviour from PCGS or if the TPGs take the initial strike quality into consideration when they grade? There was another thread here about some blacksmith tokens where the issue of how to grade a coin that was crudely struck to begins with and that's what got me thinking about this particular year of the NFLD 10c. To me this looks more like a high fine or low very fine but maybe they're just throwing it a bone because it had such a rough start in life?
Bedrock of the Community
Australia
17436 Posts
 Posted 09/26/2020  09:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You have really seen the need to sharpen up your own grading skills, especially when it comes to high grade coins, where value differences between the grades can be huge.

A good exercise is to hide the grading result on a slab and just grade what you see for yourself, as if you were buying. When buying the tendency is to grade lower, to get the item for a lower price.

Much better to examine a coin in hand, but a second best for training purposes is to have fun on the "You vs the TPG" grading threads.

Interesting that I say this, because I have no slabs in my collection.
But most other collectors do.

I do have a few Newfie silver coins in my collection, but nothing to get excited about.
Edited by sel_69l
09/26/2020 09:32 am
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
United States
3206 Posts
 Posted 09/26/2020  11:11 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add okiecoiner to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
To me, it looks VF-30 at a minimum and closer to mid-high EF. The lighter areas on the Obv high areas don't look like wear .. more like drawer rub that removes the tarnish/luster sometimes. PCGS grades almost always on the Obverses.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1693 Posts
 Posted 09/27/2020  10:45 am  Show Profile   Check nickelsguy's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add nickelsguy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The first question you must ask yourself is this......Do fully struck examples exist? If the answer is Yes.....then once luster is disturbed grading reverts to normal. The term weakly stuck can only be used for Mint State examples when fully struck exists. Therefore (like nickle 5 cents from the 20's)the grade of AU will be rare. Once luster is disturbed the coin must drop to vf/ef. I have heard many use the term AU weakly stuck. This is impossible to substantiate and assumptions are made to get there. IMO
Valued Member
Canada
384 Posts
 Posted 09/27/2020  2:56 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Silver101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@nickelsguy - thank you - that clarifies that issue for me. Though in the case of the 1870 it's pretty clear that the reverse is an issue. There are very, very few examples out there that have a legible reverse in my experience. In most cases this is likely a combination of factors including wear. But I think there's something of a consensus that the original strike was pretty crummy.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
556 Posts
 Posted 09/28/2020  2:53 pm  Show Profile   Check TheDeductible's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add TheDeductible to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
To answer your question, I do not think the grading companies take the original strike in to consideration when assigning a grade. They can't when you think about it.

Take this coin that I once posted ... https://www.coincommunity.com/forum...undland,1882

It has hardly any wear at all and its covered in mint lustre , yet because the dies were worn this coin was struck as mint state AU55 at best. No one will ever give it an MS grade because it never was that high quality of a strike.
  Previous TopicReplies: 5 / Views: 368Next Topic  
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.



Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2020 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us  |  Advertise Here  |  Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum © 2005 - 2020 Coin Community Forums
It took 0.52 seconds to rattle this change. Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000 Version 3.4.05