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Request Help With Attribution - Duchy Of Lorraine 1556 1/4 Teston

 
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Author Previous TopicReplies: 4 / Views: 134Next Topic  
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 Posted 11/19/2020  12:42 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
This will be a bit of an arcane request.
I picked up this coin recently, and I collect coins of the Duchy of Lorraine, so I know to some extent what I have, namely a quarter teston of Charles III, juvenile bust, dated 1556. There is a common variety of this type which is undated. The dated examples are more sought after. My only catalog for this region is rather old (DeSaulcy, originally published in the 19th century). DeSaulcy is OK for major types, but less strong on subtypes, and on the extant dates for each type.
I think the salient details which may define the type are these:
Obv legend ends in LOTAR.B.DVX
Rev has an anchor moneyer's mark at 6:00, and coin is dated 1556

From searching online (CoinArchives, acsearch and the cgb database), I see Boudeau references #1524, 1528 and 1534 for various examples of this type (juvenile bust).
I see Roberts references #1464 and 1465 for this type, with 1465 appearing to match my obverse legend, and having the anchor mark.
But ...
I cannot find another example of this coin dated 1556 anywhere. There are many 1554s that come up in searches, and deSaulcy mentioned the 1555, but neither with the anchor. I will also mention that the crudeness of the legends bothers me a bit, though all the other details look right.
Grateful for any further insights (for anyone interested in searching, this denomination can come up as either 1/4 teston or quart de teston).

Edited by tdziemia
11/19/2020 12:46 pm
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 Posted 11/26/2020  8:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Pertinax to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Is it the correct weight ?
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 Posted 11/27/2020  09:44 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for responding.
I don't have an accurate balance, but I can estimate it pretty closely by comparing to a recent U.S. cent (2.5 g), and get 2.3 grams.
The three examples of this type mentioned by deSaulcy (1554, 1555 and undated) range from 2.15 to 2.5 g., so I think the mass is OK.
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 Posted 11/27/2020  3:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@tdz, not sure that I can shed a whole lot of light on this coin, but here is what I have found.

Your coin isn't listed in my Duplessy, but I can find it in Roberts, "The Silver Coins of Medieval France" as #9576. In this reference, it was minted in 1553 or 1554 AD, but the inscription on the coin pictured doesn't include the date. Despite this information not being a perfect fit for your coin, I too share your concern around the dramatic difference in character shape between the last three digits of the date and then remainder of the inscriptions.
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 Posted 11/28/2020  12:13 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the Roberts reference and the comments.
The numerals in the date seem to be consistent with examples dated 1554, which also appear to use an "I" for the first digit, then similar 5's:


However, undated examples with the anchor privy mark seem to be more precisely engraved (I think it is known that the anchor was later than the dated examples from 1554 an 1555 which lack this mark):


All I can think is that maybe it is a transitional issue between the cruder 1553-1554-1555 issues and later undated ones. I've also put this out on the Numista forum figuring there are French experts over there, but not a peep yet
Edited by tdziemia
11/28/2020 12:14 am
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