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PCGS Or NGC For CDN Colonial Tokens/Coins

 
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Author Previous TopicReplies: 14 / Views: 551Next Topic  
Pillar of the Community
Canada
2568 Posts
 Posted 01/27/2021  12:28 am Show Profile   Check Wade's eBay Listings Bookmark this topic Add Wade to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I know the whole "which is better" has been done to death, and I have (until recently) never been one to consider sending in my coins for TPG slabbing...

however... as my collection grows in numbers, and value, I would like to protect that value by having my top 50 (maybe more) Canadian colonial tokens slabbed.

ICCS is known in Canada, CCCS in second (IMHO) but when playing to a world stage I am curious to know opinions on either PCGS or NGC for early CDN coinage?

Coin Collecting... "I'm in it for the money"
Pillar of the Community
United States
1339 Posts
 Posted 01/27/2021  4:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add owatchman to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm not sure about tokens, but for world coins, my go to is NGC first.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
544 Posts
 Posted 01/27/2021  4:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Silver101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I was told by a reputable dealer that PCGS is known by potential purchasers everywhere...including in particular the USA which is the biggest market. So they are the go-to for that reason. On the other hand, ICCS and CCCS both have their virtues and would definitely know your tokens better than PCGS or NGC. Though ICCS doesn't have a hard holder yet...

Those are some considerations. My policy (on those rare occasions that I go to TPG) is PCGS for something potentially worth more than $500, ICCS for something potentially worth less than that.
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Canada
9598 Posts
 Posted 01/28/2021  12:09 pm  Show Profile   Check SPP-Ottawa's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add SPP-Ottawa to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you look at those who are slabbing tokens, CCF's own 1960NYGiants uses PCGS.

"Discovery follows discovery, each both raising and answering questions, each ending a long search, and each providing the new instruments for a new search." -- J. Robert Oppenheimer

Content of this post is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 3.0 Unported License. See: http://creativecommons.org/licenses...0/deed.en_US

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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1690 Posts
 Posted 01/28/2021  12:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add papeldog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I agree with all Silver101 comments NCG might be the best bet for World coins I don't really collect World coins as a hobby but have acquired many through my years of collecting.

I have crack a few uncirculated NCG Canadian large cent coins out of their hard slabs and sent them to PCGS every one come back cleaned or over graded, both ANACS + ICCS I have had the same experience.

I use PCGS for all now and I feel comfortable I'm going in thr right direction
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1274 Posts
 Posted 01/28/2021  12:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 47P7 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
PapelDog, Happy NewYear.... have you been away, or did I just not see your posts?

In a response you mentioned some time ago you had a really easy and good way of shipping coins to PCGS for grading.
Would you please be kind enough to let us in on your secret?
Thank you
H

Pillar of the Community
Canada
528 Posts
 Posted 01/30/2021  01:04 am  Show Profile   Check TerryT's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add TerryT to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My understanding is that Louis Chevrier specialized in Canadian colonial tokens before he started CCCS. Conservative grader.
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3515 Posts
 Posted 01/30/2021  08:19 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add okiecoiner to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
papeldog has been using a different moniker on other sites I think
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1190 Posts
 Posted 01/30/2021  09:17 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add purelywasted to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
A tough question and I think it comes down to what do you want to do with your collection?

Are my coins valuable enough to slab? Is a registry set important? Keep for personal? Resell later? Keep for kids? Make easier to sell later in life?

If collection is not overly valuable, I really like quadrum 2x2. But if coins are of high value and eventual sale is goal going PCGS is a good bet, but for 50 coins, I'm guessing $3000 for PCGS, where as you can do 100 at ICCS for less than $1000.

Biggest things of PCGS I see are
+ hard slab for protection
+ registry sets (if you do that)
+ recognized and resale
+ doug robbins and other token sets to give life to PCGS market at upper end
- high cost in terms of slabbing and handling
- questionable skills at grading mid grade (15-58) coins
- coin is not very accessible for study

NGC
- similar to PCGS, but arguable not to same name recognition
- I like current PCGS slabs better in terms of look

ICCS
+ cost is amazing, especially in bulk orders
+ less storage space required
- soft holders
- lower name recognition in intl market
- coin is not accessible for detailed look/photos

I am wrestling with same issue for my collection. Doing ICCS for mid value coins (a 110 coin submission, not much of an incremental cost from 50 due to due to discount for bulk). Will be putting best in PCGS for registry/protection purposes

Overall, I really like simplicity and look of quadrum 2x2, my loonies and toonies look nice in binder on black background. But for resale, graded 8s much better

Pillar of the Community
Canada
2337 Posts
 Posted 01/30/2021  6:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add doubleeagle59 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
When researching prices realized for Canadian coins that have been sold when graded by ICCS, PCGS and NGC, I believe it is a no brainer that ICCS commands a higher price.

Nuf said.
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Canada
2568 Posts
 Posted 03/04/2021  7:55 pm  Show Profile   Check Wade's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Wade to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I believe it is a no brainer that ICCS commands a higher price.


I wonder if that carries over to international sales? Or just within Canada?

I struggle between ICCS's recognition vs CCCS hard slabs, but also PCGS's fee structure.

If comparing a $500 coin in an ICCS holder vs the same coin in a PCGS holder, would a person see the difference in investment vs return?
Coin Collecting... "I'm in it for the money"
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1274 Posts
 Posted 03/04/2021  10:13 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 47P7 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have my serious (and personally experienced) doubts with NGC on international coins, specifically Canadian coins. In 3 individual cases from 3 different submitters, they "managed " to positively wrongly designate well-known varieties. when brought to their attention via email, the answer was each time: if you do not agree with our assessment, you can always return it for re-assessment.
NO thanks.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
2337 Posts
 Posted 03/05/2021  5:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add doubleeagle59 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you want to maximize your value of your Canadian tokens and coins, you must sell to a Canadian and this would dictate having your collection graded by ICCS.

World and US coins should be graded by PCGS.

It's my opinion that NGC and/or PCGS slabs of Canadian coins when sold to a Canadian, will sell for less than a coin graded by ICCS..

Edited by doubleeagle59
03/05/2021 5:17 pm
Valued Member
Canada
51 Posts
 Posted 03/07/2021  01:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Levaril to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
If you want to maximize your value of your Canadian tokens and coins, you must sell to a Canadian and this would dictate having your collection graded by ICCS.


This is subjective. IMHO which grading company to use is conditional upon what you are having graded. If you are submitting a mid-grade low-ish value coin then ICCS will definitely do the best job of grading it correctly and will also be the most cost effective by far. That doesn't actually guarantee that you will maximize the value though as there are always people who buy the holder, not the coin. PCGS or NGC will likely grade you higher, possibly a lot higher, and sadly that could maximize your value if the right person comes along. Generally though yes, I'd go with ICCS.

If you have an uncirculated higher value coin? I'd go with PCGS for the slab any time. Yes more expansive and a pain to get slabbed, not to mention the time it will take, but for a high value uncirculated coin I would definitely pay more for PCGS than ICCS. PCGS grades them correctly and on top of of that they are picky about little things like subtle cleaning or altered surfaces along with a variety of other things that ICCS will let slide through. PCGS (or NGC) all day long.

Also for 50c and larger those ICCS flips kinda suck. I'd rather have the hard slab.

This is of course just my opinion. :)

Lev
Valued Member
United States
300 Posts
 Posted 03/07/2021  6:29 pm  Show Profile   Check 1960NYGiants's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 1960NYGiants to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
As SPP stated I have submitted many tokens to PCGS. That said, I have also purchased many tokens in NGC slabs. Overall, I think NGC does a better job at variety identification than PCGS. Both are so-so when grading. And both are especially poor at grading the poorly manufactured issues such as Bust & Harps, Blacksmith's, Tiffins, contemporary counterfeits, etc.

As always buy the token not the slab.
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