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Price PCGS / NGC Details

 
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Author Previous TopicReplies: 15 / Views: 527Next Topic  
Valued Member
Russian Federation
262 Posts
 Posted 05/10/2021  05:56 am Show Profile   Check Slerk's eBay Listings Bookmark this topic Add Slerk to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Looking through lots on trading platforms, very often I come across coins in slab PCGS/NGC marked with Details. How can you correctly estimate the cost of such coins, so as not to overpay ?
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United States
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 Posted 05/10/2021  07:27 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Usually the coin will be worth less because of the details grade.
John1
( I'm no pro, it's just my humble opinion )
Searched 5+ Million Cents Since 1971
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United States
5254 Posts
 Posted 05/10/2021  08:23 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add kanga to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
One Possibility: Search auction results for the particular coin with the same (or close to the same) description. eBay would likely be the best place to look.

Or do something similar to what I do.
Decide what you think the value would be IF it weren't a DETAILS coin.
Divide that number in half.
Then subtract additional amounts depending on the the type and severity of the details problem.
The final value that you arrive at should be your maximum bid.
Describe it as if there were no picture.
Picture it as if there were no description.
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 Posted 05/10/2021  09:06 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There's no way to generalize on this. The type and extent of damage will vary from one coin to the next.
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Russian Federation
262 Posts
 Posted 05/10/2021  09:17 am  Show Profile   Check Slerk's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Slerk to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I want to purchase 1/2 cent 1806 small 6, no stems F cleaning.

PCGS evaluates it as F. F/2=VG8. Looking at the cost in the VG8 states?
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 Posted 05/10/2021  10:41 am  Show Profile   Check westcoin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add westcoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
No coin in a details holder can be priced on a sheet, every single one will need to stand on it's own merits.

Rarity?
Variety?
Amount of damage or reason for Detail grade?
Price of normal or non detailed version of the same coin?

I usually figure anywhere from 25% off to 80% off a coin in non details if it was the same. I find the usual drop is around 40-50% off in most cases.

Sometimes I can't tell what the details reason is for, like a cleaning or dipping? In that type of case, it is sort of whatever you want to pay, are you planning on reholdering the coin again? moving it to another TPG service? Keeping raw?

There just isn't a set answer to this question. Many people won't even look at a details holder coin, and I think that can be a mistake, especially when looking at ultra rare variety or a coin you normally wouldn't run across at any price. See my friend Mark Borckardt give a talk on this very subject at the 2015 EAC conference:

https://nnp.wustl.edu/library/book/540235
"Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin" - Aaron R. Feldman - "And read it" - Me 2013!
ANA Life Member #3288 in good standing since 1982, EAC Member #6202, NBS Member, 2 variety collector.

See my want page: http://goccf.com/t/140440
Edited by westcoin
05/10/2021 10:43 am
Valued Member
Russian Federation
262 Posts
 Posted 05/10/2021  11:46 am  Show Profile   Check Slerk's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Slerk to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
westcoin, Sorry, but my English is not good enough to watch the whole video.
Cleaning coins worth considering for buying?
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 Posted 05/10/2021  12:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add thq to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This is a cleaned details VF. The obverse is about VF30, reverse EF40.



I got it for half the price of a straight grade VF, and it looks better than most of them. Right now I can't find a straight grade VF to compare it to on the bay.
"Two minutes ago I would have sold my chances for a tired dime." Fred Astaire
Edited by thq
05/10/2021 12:21 pm
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 Posted 05/10/2021  4:44 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CoinHunter27 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'd agree with Coinfrog on this one. Depends on the coin itself and how rare or desirable the coin is. Some varieties can be extremely rare and still bring a nice premium if it's rare enough. Same goes for any kind of coin that details if you ask me.

-CH27
Collector of U.S. varieties and errors
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 Posted 05/10/2021  5:27 pm  Show Profile   Check westcoin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add westcoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
westcoin, Sorry, but my English is not good enough to watch the whole video.
Cleaning coins worth considering for buying?



Sorry about that. But yes in some cases I have and do buy details coins, especially when there are no other options or the deal is a very good one in my mind.

Rare coins that don't surface often, varieties that can be very difficult to locate, if they come up in a detail holder and still have nice eye appeal then depending on the price I would always consider them.

On common coins that have been cleaned, one I can find not cleaned easily enough, then I tend to avoid those.
"Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin" - Aaron R. Feldman - "And read it" - Me 2013!
ANA Life Member #3288 in good standing since 1982, EAC Member #6202, NBS Member, 2 variety collector.

See my want page: http://goccf.com/t/140440
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 Posted 05/10/2021  6:04 pm  Show Profile   Check Collects82's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Collects82 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The early American coppers like you are buying often have a details issue. Collectors of the series are accustomed to seeing pieces with varying amounts of corrosion, dings, cleanings, dents, and other "environmental damage". The copper used to make these was rather soft and the elements beat them up pretty good. Also the series has long been avidly collected making a cleaning along the way risky that someone somewhere tried. For your particular piece, you will have to see how bad the cleaning is and weigh that vs rarity of the date and variety. If it was an old, light cleaning and the original patina has generally returned, it might not discount too much. If it still looks like someone tried to make a brand new penny out of it, then it could a heavy discount of 50% or more. Also, sometimes there are more than one problems with these coins, and the label only mentions the most obvious, so there could still be dings and corrosion issues of note you will want to get a feel for.
My hoard of '82s is up to 204! 218 BC x 1, 118 BC x 3, 18 BC x 1, 82 x 1, 182 x 1, 282 x 2, 382 x 1, 582 x 2, 682 x 1, 782 x 2, 882 x 1, 982 x 4, 1082 x 1 1182 x 8, 1282 x 2, 1382 x 1, 1482 x 5, 1582 x 13, 1682 x 15, 1782 x 57, 1882 x 49, 1982 x 33
Edited by Collects82
05/10/2021 6:06 pm
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 Posted 05/10/2021  6:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Adam_E to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If the problem isn't extreme Ex a hole, bent, or deep corrosion, I would be happy to pay a 10% discount on the lowest problem free letter grade value value.

So if a coin is VF details: cleaned, I would look to the F-12 pricing and pay 10% off that. I figure most cleanings and surface problems can be circulated down a letter grade and in theory become straight grades.
Valued Member
Russian Federation
262 Posts
 Posted 05/10/2021  8:07 pm  Show Profile   Check Slerk's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Slerk to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I once bought myself 1 cent of 1803 and although this coin has a very low rating, I am pleased to realize that it is without Details.


I am currently collecting a set of "Basic U.S. Coin Design Set No Gold (1792-present)" and I need a 1/2 cent coin. So I think how much should be my price so as not to overpay for such a coin. I don't care at all about the year and the variety I don't even know which of the varieties are rare and which are not.
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 Posted 05/10/2021  10:35 pm  Show Profile   Check westcoin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add westcoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Look at the 1804 Half Cents, lots of varieties available and many in really good shape, not too expensive considering they are rare. In fact all the Half Cents added together, are less common in population than 1909-S VDB Cents today, yet the 1909-S VDB will cost 5 or 6 times the price of a nice Half Cent.
"Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin" - Aaron R. Feldman - "And read it" - Me 2013!
ANA Life Member #3288 in good standing since 1982, EAC Member #6202, NBS Member, 2 variety collector.

See my want page: http://goccf.com/t/140440
Pillar of the Community
United States
950 Posts
 Posted 05/11/2021  12:19 pm  Show Profile   Check Collects82's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Collects82 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you are OK with an AG coin that is not details and still a pleasant eye appeal, with a little patience on this series you should be able to land one for $50-60. 1807 is another date that pops up rather frequently with dealers that do EAC and type stuff. Even a solid G should be under $100, and VG maybe not much over, it maybe you can still haggle your way down to double digits still. Maybe with Fine they start to pickup in $. In AG/G, it's really not an expensive series. I like them a lot. Give yourself a little time.
My hoard of '82s is up to 204! 218 BC x 1, 118 BC x 3, 18 BC x 1, 82 x 1, 182 x 1, 282 x 2, 382 x 1, 582 x 2, 682 x 1, 782 x 2, 882 x 1, 982 x 4, 1082 x 1 1182 x 8, 1282 x 2, 1382 x 1, 1482 x 5, 1582 x 13, 1682 x 15, 1782 x 57, 1882 x 49, 1982 x 33
Edited by Collects82
05/11/2021 12:20 pm
Valued Member
Russian Federation
262 Posts
 Posted 05/12/2021  12:30 am  Show Profile   Check Slerk's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Slerk to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't care what the coin's condition is. The state of FR/AG/G suits me perfectly.

I will probably wait for a better offer, but very few sellers on eBay ship outside of the US and this is a big problem for me.
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