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Walking Back In Time From 1600 To Antiquity By Decades (V3.0)

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 Posted 11/24/2021  07:23 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
More great 1410s additions to this thread. Keep 'em coming!
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb

"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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 Posted 11/24/2021  07:55 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Especially enjoying the parade of French coins this decade. That gros with the crowned lilies is spectacular!
Unfortunately I've nothing narrowly dated from my Lorraine collection through the late 14th and 15th centuries. Too many long-lived dukes.

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 Posted 11/24/2021  09:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add january1may to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
so many awesome coins for the 1410s! I was afraid that this decade would be almost empty, but it isn't.

Now I'm hoping the same could be true for the 1400s...


Here's what the date situation looks like, as far as I can tell...

1419 - @Spence
1418 - none yet
1417 - @Spence
1416-15 - none yet
1414 - @erafjel (?)
1413 - @erafjel
1412 - none yet
1411 - @Spence
1410 - none yet

We're apparently rapidly running out of dates.
@Grinya, do you have any Golden Horde and/or Crimean coins to add?

The current list of missing dates so far: 1486?, 1460, 1453, 1452?, 1435, 1432, 1430, 1425, 1424, 1418, 1416, 1415, 1412, 1410.
But some of the "non-missing" dates could be uncertain French emissions.

Note that I assigned @erafjel's Dec 1413-June 1414 emission to the year 1414, as the vast majority of the apparent minting period is in that year.
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 Posted 11/24/2021  10:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add erafjel to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Note that I assigned @erafjel's Dec 1413-June 1414 emission to the year 1414, as the vast majority of the apparent minting period is in that year.

Probably a fair assumption. Hopefully the mint workers got time off over Christmas .


Quote:
when in the Middle Ages January 1 generally stopped being the first day of the new year?

Well, for France then:

Jan 1, as stipulated by Julius Caesar, applied until around 500 AD, when the Merovingian kings took over after the Romans. Interestingly, they preferred the pre-Julian calendar, with the year beginning March 1.

Charlemagne introduced Dec 25 as the 1st day of the year (maybe in 800 AD, when he was crowned emperor by the pope on Dec 25).

Some time in the early 12th century, Easter day took over as the 1st day of the year, and that lasted until 1566, which had Jan 1 as its 1st day.

Of course the French, being the way they are , did not follow this completely. Some regions kept the March 1 year, some used March 25 (spring equinox), and other dates were used too.

And then there is of course the much later revolutionary (or republican) calendar during and after the French Revolution. According to that, year 1 of the French Republic began Sept 22, 1792. Napoleon re-introduced the Gregorian calendar in 1805. This is the only calendar change that has left an impression on coinage, as all French coins from the period are marked, for instance, L'AN 6 ("The year 6").

No more coins from me until the 1380s!
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 Posted 11/24/2021  4:50 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add JohnConduitt to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have a few Golden Horde coins, but unfortunately, I can't date them. This period is a bit past the heyday for the Golden Horde...

Pulad Khan Dirham, 1408 or 1410

Bulgar. Silver, 0.7g. Just Sultan Pulad Khan, may his reign last long. Bulgar Mint, struck in AH810 or AH812 (Sagdeeva 491).

Sagdeeva has this coin as dated either AH810 or AH812 (AD1408 or AD1410), but the part of the coin with the date (the bottom of the reverse, a little cut off) doesn't match Sagdeeva's illustrations and doesn't look like a date in any case.
Edited by JohnConduitt
11/24/2021 6:46 pm
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 Posted 11/25/2021  09:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Some time in the early 12th century, Easter day took over as the 1st day of the year


That probably confirms what I thought I had read about the Low Countries using Easter rather than March 25.

That discussion over the last few days will make me more attentive to the specific calendar dates attached to the coins as we move ahead (I mean, back). Though next decade I will have things that aren't dated from documentary evidence like this, or at least not that I can access.
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 Posted 11/25/2021  11:18 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I've learned a ton this past week on this thread too! Any more coins to post or are we ready to drop back again. Let's plan to go to the decade of the 1400s starting tomorrow morning. Last call for the 1410s!
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb

"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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 Posted 11/25/2021  2:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add JohnConduitt to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Not a great coin, but we're doing well with a run of Henrys and I don't have another one.

Henry IV Light Coinage Halfpenny, 1412-1413

Tower. Silver, 0.56g. Crowned bust facing, annulet/pellet either side in upper field; HENRIC REX ANGL. Long cross pattée with three pellets in each angle; CIVITAS LONDON (S 1737).

The light coinage was struck after the Easter 1412 coinage reform, and Henry IV died on 20 March 1413 (which was actually still 1412 at the time). Although I'm a little confused as it's meant to be the light coinage, and while the detail I can make out seems to fit that (e.g. pellet by crown), the weight is closer to the pre-reform size! When were English medieval coins ever clear...
Edited by JohnConduitt
11/25/2021 4:29 pm
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 Posted 11/26/2021  07:49 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This Poland half groat minted in Krakow has been attributed to 1407 based on the letter n under the crown (mintmaster Mikolaj (Nicolaus) Follisfessilowi). 1.3 grams. Kop. 361 and Pawlikowski type IX.



Obv: Crown with letter n below. +MONE*WLADISLAI
Rev: Crowned eagle facing left. +REGISPOLONIE

Interesting letter S with exaggerated gothic ornamentation especially in the word REGIS reverse
Edited by tdziemia
11/26/2021 07:53 am
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 Posted 11/26/2021  10:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here is one of two dated coins that I have from this decade. This Groschen is from the German City of Aachen and is dated 1403 AD. The obv legend is SCS hAROL MAGNVS IPERAT while the rev legend is +ANNO DOMINI MILLESIMO CCCC TERCIO and MON ETA VRB AQEN. It is attributed as Levinson I-6 and is my second oldest coin in Levinson. That giant chip in the flan is very unfortunate, but the remaining coin seems to be stable.



"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb

"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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 Posted 11/26/2021  9:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Impressed that you still have DATED coins this far back!
I have only one other attributable to a specific date this decade, another Polish half groat, this one attributable to 1403 by the letter A under the crown (mintmaster Andrzej Czarnyszy). 1.68 g. Kopicki 366, Pawlikowski type V.



For anyone pursuing an OFEY and looking for dates in this decade, Poland half groats have been attributed to 1403, 1407 and 1408. You can find them online by putting Poland 1403 (or the other dates) into CoinArchives or acsearch for research purposes.

Edited by tdziemia
11/26/2021 9:59 pm
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 Posted 11/26/2021  10:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add january1may to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yet more awesome coins!

@JohnConduitt's Henry IV coin (if it is what it is) is from the year 1412 (especially so with the calendar mess), closing one of the gaps.
This leaves only the following gaps in the 1410-1460 range: 1460, 1453, 1452?, 1435?, 1432, 1430, 1425, 1424, 1418, 1416, 1415, 1410? - a total of 12/51 years missing (though there might be a few more with careful examination of the French emission dates).


For this decade I only have those two very worn Prague groschens of Wenceslas IV, which could have been minted, to the best of my knowledge, at any time from 1405 to 1419 - or possibly (in fact fairly likely) even posthumously in the 1420s!
AFAIK there are some very detailed studies of Prague groschens that assign more precise dates to specific sub-types. So far I have yet to encounter any such study in any way other than as a vague reference.

Unusually for the period, Wenceslas is specifically identified by his regnal number (Tercius = the Third, apparently because the brief reign of Wenceslas III was not counted at the time), a tradition that goes back to at least the earliest Prague groschens, of Wenceslas II a century earlier.
Offhand I can't think of any other coin issues even from the 15th century, never mind the 14th, that included a ruler's regnal number. I wonder how much does the more modern tradition, where regnal numbers are the norm rather than the exception, owe to the Prague groschens; I know that many countries didn't use regnal numbers on their coins even in the 16th century.





I bought these coins from a seller who had a large assortment of Prague groschens at $3 each. These two were the best of several dozen; most of them were even more illegible. All that were legible enough to tell the ruler were from Wenceslas IV.

I apologize for the rotated photos; they were definitely the right way up when I originally uploaded them (in 2017).
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 Posted 11/27/2021  07:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
That's an interesting observation on the regnal numbers.

I think the earliest I have in my collection are the later coins of Sigismund I of Poland. Starting in 1526 (20 years into his reign) an increasing number of his coins bear the title SIGISMVND PRIM, or SIGISMVND I, since his son had already been anointed as the next king.
Ironically, that son never used Sigismund II, but was known as Sigismund August.
The elder Sigismund (and his mintmasters) would have been familiar with the Prager Groschens, which probably also circulated in parts of Poland.
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 Posted 11/27/2021  09:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add JohnConduitt to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Offhand I can't think of any other coin issues even from the 15th century, never mind the 14th, that included a ruler's regnal number.

The only example I know of in England is Henry III on his long cross coinage from 1248. These issues were also very popular in Europe because of their high silver content. Unfortunately, this useful feature (for us) was not continued by the run of Edwards who reigned immediately after Henry. But regnal numbers did appear again with Henry VIII on his 2nd coinage from 1526.
Edited by JohnConduitt
11/27/2021 2:02 pm
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 Posted 11/27/2021  12:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Great discussion on regal numbers. I'll have to dig through some of my notes but might have some to add as I looked at the use of numbers in medieval coins a couple years ago. Unfortunately still not published, but maybe someday.

Here is my other dated coin for this decade. This Groschen from Aachen is dated 1405 AD. The rev inscription is +ANNO DOMINI MILLESIMO CCCC QVINTO and MON ETA VRB AQEN, so still a mix of Latin and Roman numerals. It is attributed as Levinson I-8 and is a COVID-era pick-up for me. There are a couple flan cracks, so I'm definitely not using this one as a pocket piece!



"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb

"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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