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1858 10 Cent, An Interesting Coin

 
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Author Previous TopicReplies: 15 / Views: 886Next Topic  
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1472 Posts
 Posted 09/02/2021  9:09 pm Show Profile   Check 47P7's eBay Listings Bookmark this topic Add 47P7 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Please, fellows, take a crack on grading it.
Also what designation and or comments would it get?
thank you
H


Pillar of the Community
Canada
1261 Posts
 Posted 09/03/2021  05:16 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add purelywasted to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm at AU58 or MS 63, can't quite make out if that is rub or lighting on the braid. It might have some kind of light cleaning/scratches at RHS/bottom of 2nd picture or that could just be caused by the scratches.

A nice example of the coin either way. hope you enjoy it!
Pillar of the Community
Canada
2356 Posts
 Posted 09/04/2021  2:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add doubleeagle59 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wow, that's a tough one to grade, mainly because of the bright lighting.

The lighting makes it appear to have lots of luster, but my gut tells me there's not much.

I'm thinking a big range of ef45 to ms62.

I'll stick my neck out with a guess of au55.
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United States
2391 Posts
 Posted 09/04/2021  3:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add fortcollins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Beautiful coin!

I see the difficulty here. The top knot suggests UNC, while the eyebrow, cheek, hair curl in front of the ear and braid suggest AU. The strike is soft in the central devices, but strong peripherally. There is plenty of luster for any AU/lower UNC grade. The toning makes it difficult to determine disruption in the fields around the portrait. The scratch on the neck is a concern, and suggests a staple scratch.

With that in mind, I could see an ICCS net grade of AU-50 (possibly AU-55 now) or a PCGS or NGC grade of AU-58. Very nice coin!
Pillar of the Community
Canada
552 Posts
 Posted 09/07/2021  02:47 am  Show Profile   Check TerryT's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add TerryT to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looks to me like the 5/5 variety, with the double-punched last A in CANADA. There are also die clash impressions on the obverse with the "sharkfin" showing on top of her head under the T of GRATIA. More die clash marks at the forehead and behind the hair bun.
There's a bit of wear on the laurel wreath, the braid around the ear, and the forehead, so AU-58. Too bad about the small scratches. Hope the colour is nicer than it appears-is it rust-coloured or gold ? May have been dipped and partially retoned.
Valued Member
Australia
388 Posts
 Posted 09/07/2021  04:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echidna to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
MS64
A man who tells lies merely hides the truth. But a man who tells half-lies has forgotten where he put it.
Pillar of the Community
United States
2554 Posts
 Posted 09/10/2021  8:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Oldfordman to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
MS62
Pillar of the Community
Canada
641 Posts
 Posted 09/23/2021  1:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Silver101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
That is a thing of beauty. MS but I would argue that the eye appeal is 90% of the story here.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
849 Posts
 Posted 09/27/2021  12:07 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Numis-Northerner to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
With the wear on the obverse I could not go higher than AU-58+ as a grade, that said, I could absolutely see a premium price of a coin in a higher grade being realized for this. I also gotta check because I think I have this coins younger sibling judging by the die cracks on yours.
Bedrock of the Community
Australia
19083 Posts
 Posted 09/27/2021  12:33 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There is no wear on this coin, (reverse shows this best), so it has to be some sort of MS grade, but there is some old light rubbing on the high points, that disturbed the patina in those areas.
Enough light scratches to keep it at
MS-63.

I can understand why some opinions are at AU-58.

Eye appeal is in the eyes of those to whom it appeals, except to say that it won't look like this in 50 years' time.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1472 Posts
 Posted 09/27/2021  11:01 am  Show Profile   Check 47P7's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 47P7 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
SEL_691


Quote:
except to say that it won't look like this in 50 years' time.

This is an interesting observation. What do you think will happen with the coin within the next 50 Years? which way do you think will it tone?
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Australia
13845 Posts
 Posted 09/27/2021  10:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Toning on coins is caused by the formation of a thin layer of corrosion - in the case of silver coins, the corrosion product is silver sulfide. By the laws of thin-film optics, the colour change follows the rainbow: red is thinnest, then orange, yellow, green and blue. After blue comes black, as the "thin layer" becomes too think to be transparent to light.

So for a coin like this that exhibits all of these colours, if left exposed to the atmosphere, the patterns will shift. The "black bits" will spread, as the bluish-green parts next to the black get thicker. The orange and red parts will turn bluer. And the currently untoned parts will turn red and orange. This is all assuming the toning is uniform; if the coin has some kind of surface adherent, or was cleaned long ago creating areas of "activation" that tone faster, or if the storage medium has "holes" that focus the pollutants on certain areas of the coin, then all bets are off as to which bits of the coin will tone when.

Protecting from the elements - particularly the element sulfur - will slow down the toning process. Keeping sulfur away is hard, but as a general rule, if you've managed to keep water out, then you've kept the sulfur out as well, as all sulfur-containing molecules are smaller than water molecules. But simply filling your coin storage with dessicant isn't necessarily going to prevent toning, as dessicant doesn't absorb sulfur.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1472 Posts
 Posted 09/28/2021  01:03 am  Show Profile   Check 47P7's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 47P7 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
SAP
Thank you... what an explanation of toning!!!!
If I only would understand it, even though you tried to explain it straight forward. Still much to much chemical technology for me...
Thank you for that... amazing!!
So, are you trying to say, sort of, that this dime will be black 50 years from now?
just amazing...Oh, I have a black Canadian 50 cent coin, 1938
H
Bedrock of the Community
Australia
19083 Posts
 Posted 09/28/2021  03:50 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sap has said it much better, and with more detail, than I was able to do.
Toning is a one way progressive process. All that a coin collector can do, is to slow it down.
The best way to do this is, to house each coin in it's own air tight container.
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Australia
13845 Posts
 Posted 09/28/2021  04:19 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It probably won't go all the way to black within 50 years, unless it's placed in a sulfur-rich environment (hint: if you want it to turn black, keep it in the kitchen). But after 50 years, it will probably look different from how it looks now.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1472 Posts
 Posted 09/28/2021  10:10 am  Show Profile   Check 47P7's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 47P7 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think since I am not in love with it, It will not "age" in my kitchen, but it might be sold sometime down the road.
Thank you, guys. very educating info.
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