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 Replies: 10 / Views: 435 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1639 Posts |
Opinions on this piece. Thanks.   |
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Moderator
 United States
28422 Posts |
@col, you know tons more about these things than me, but we did have have another coin posted very recently with an added X scrawled across the neck that was counterfeit (link below). http://goccf.com/t/445918Of course the very nature of graffiti is that the reason for it may be unknowable. What really catches my eye on this coin though is the doubling on the reverse. I'd like to know more about that and hopefully one of you experts can talk to that as this thread progresses. "If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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Pillar of the Community
Topic StarterUnited States
1639 Posts |
The weight is forth coming - concerning the reverse to me that is push shift doubling or in general terms " Machine Doubling". There is also die clashing of obverse elements like the ordinal of CAROLUS III seen clearly at K-1 on the obverse. Perhaps the obverse and reverse dies clashed - loosening then the reverse die then possibly creating the Machine Doubling reverse motifs. I suspect this piece is regal. https://www.error-ref.com/push-doubling/John Lorenzo Numismatist Edited by colonialjohn
05/19/2023 9:48 pm
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1146 Posts |
Could also be a bullion forgery. Someone put a big X on the neck -- that's NOT a vote of confidence for regal weight or SG.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1609 Posts |
Had the same thought about that big X. Some of my fakes are mutilated with cuts, gashes, holes, etc.
It's just that this X isn't so pronounced as mutilations I have.
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Moderator
United States
28422 Posts |
Good point about the die clash at 12 o'clock, but are you sure that is MD on the R F F at 9-10 o'clock? I'm just not sure what is going on and as always, glad to learn something.
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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Pillar of the Community
Topic StarterUnited States
1639 Posts |
It was determined to be real with a weight of 25.68 grams and opposite edge overlaps (K-2/K-8) confirmed. I then considered this scenario - the dies clashed creating these ordinals we see at K-1/2 on the reverse - after the clashing perhaps the reverse die was loosened then creating this push/type Machine Doubling on all reverse motifs IMO during a second striking. So a nice 18thC Mexican error with associated Chinese cropmarks. Herb Robinson Collection. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1146 Posts |
25.68 grams? Is that a typo? No way that could be regal.
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Pillar of the Community
Topic StarterUnited States
1639 Posts |
Yes thanks for the clarification - 26.58 grams. Its regal. As further clarification came in from the owner.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1832 Posts |
I was holding my tongue since looking at this piece, I was shocked to see a weight that low. Updated weight makes much more sense. Machine Doubling and die clash definitely observed on regal pieces (you see a decent number of clashed specimens of the lower denominations as well). Coin presents as regal visually. The X is curious, but while that of course can be a cancellation mark, it can also be a political statement or even just someone with too much time on their hands. |
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Pillar of the Community
Topic StarterUnited States
1639 Posts |
Case closed with the CONFIRMED 180* opposite overlapped edges. The "X" cancellation mark also made be go down the WRONG road initially. <BG>
Edited by colonialjohn
05/23/2023 1:19 pm
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Replies: 10 / Views: 435 |
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Posted 05/19/2023 9:44 pm
