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7 Mace And 2 Candareens

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New Member

United States
2 Posts
 Posted 08/23/2011  05:10 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add President to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
This is from my great grandfathers collection. He visited China numerous times. I do not know the weight, but a small unreliable scale shows it at 20 grams. Again it is unreliable. The coin "sounds silver" and magnets do not stick to it.

I would like to know what the symbols say as I have not been able to find any others with the same symbols on the reverse top. I would enjoy and feedback or comments. Thanks so much!



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Australia
13853 Posts
 Posted 08/23/2011  08:59 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hello, and welcome to the forum.

I wish we could be the bearers of good news, but alas, we can't. The Chinese have been making fakes of their own dollars and selling them to tourists for a long time now, and yours is one such fake.

The main giveaway that this is not a genuine silver dollar is that the Chinese inscriptions contradict what the English inscriptions on the other side say. At the top, the Chinese inscription reads "Made in FuKien Province", while the other side says "HuPeh Province". Genuine coins always say the same province on both sides. Compare your inscriptions with this Fukien dollar and this Hupeh dollar.

This kind of die mix-up is very commonly seen on these counterfeit dollars; the counterfeiters simply didn't try very hard to match up the obverse and reverse dies. If you had it tested more precisely, I suspect you will find that your coin is too light (genuine dollars should weigh about 26.7 grams) and not actually made of silver.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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Australia
3388 Posts
 Posted 08/23/2011  12:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gxseries to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This die detail can be quite troubling and I will explain why. When I first looked at the first image, I nearly thought it looked VERY real. But given the details of the obverse being Fookien Province as well as the wrong weight, it can't be real. Details of the Fookien designs aren't right.

As Sap mentioned, the weight is supposed to be 26.7g and there's practically no way dies can be mixed up unless mints were playing some kind of mint sport. Lastly, Fookien dollar coins are quite scarce.

It sucks to hear all these but Chinese coins have always been counterfeited for many years as well as prices of them are just too hot this year.
My partial coin collection http://www.omnicoin.com/collection/gxseries

My numismatics articles and collection: http://www.gxseries.com/numis/numis_index.htm Regularly updated at least once a month.
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United States
2 Posts
 Posted 08/23/2011  12:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add President to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
First of all thank you very much for taking the time to answer my question. I do appreciate the knowledge everyone has provided.

At first I thought I may have selected the wrong picture of the front, but sadly I did not.... and I agree that it must be a fake. We have 34 of these coins and all of them appear to be fake as they weight the same....about 21 grams.

We only looked a these coins becasue of the price of silver lately. I do plan on having the coin tested for silver but my only optimism will be my two crossed fingers :)

Thank you again for the feedback!
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Australia
3388 Posts
 Posted 08/23/2011  1:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gxseries to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I wouldn't hold my breath - most likely nickel copper. It's not too hard to imitate the sound of silver with nickel copper except the weight.
My partial coin collection http://www.omnicoin.com/collection/gxseries

My numismatics articles and collection: http://www.gxseries.com/numis/numis_index.htm Regularly updated at least once a month.
New Member
Germany
1 Posts
 Posted 10/03/2011  11:22 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add firool to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hello,

i found some coins too in an old box with a lot of different things.
But the weight of this 4 coins is 21 gramm each and the diameter is ~39mm
and it is not magnetic.

From the looking I would tell they are original but I am confused about the weight...

Can you tell me something obout the coins?









(right click on the big picture -> show picture - to see the original/full size of the picture)

Thanks
firool
Edited by firool
10/03/2011 12:43 pm
Pillar of the Community
United States
5225 Posts
 Posted 10/03/2011  2:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add swamperbob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
firool The key fact in your note is the WEIGHT. A weight of 21 grams is simply too lite to be real. The real silver dollars weigh in the 25-26 gram range and wear DOES NOT REMOVE MUCH METAL. A coin worn down to 21 grams would not have any details left at all it would be a virtually flat slug. Coins were made LOW PROFILE so that wear in excess of 5% rendered them USELESS. Then they were melted down and restruck.

All of the coins you picture have been counterfeited extensively for many years.

As a collector of counterfeits I would estimate the value of these coins at no more than $5 each - and that is if you can find an interested buyer who does not already own the variety. I typically pay $1 each just to remove these fakes from the marketplace. I own hundreds if not thousands of them.
My book on Counterfeit Portrait 8Rs is available from Amazon https://www.amazon.com/Counterfeit-.../1500497177/ or from me directly if you want it signed.
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United States
1 Posts
 Posted 07/22/2014  9:56 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rosyleo to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi
I also have a coin HU-PEH that my grandfather gave me. Could someone tell me what it reads and if is real or fake.
Thank you



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Australia
13853 Posts
 Posted 07/22/2014  10:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi rosyleo, and welcome.

On your coin, at least the province-name in Chinese matches the province-name in English - unlike the coin at the top of this thread. Unfortunately, your coin is nevertheless also not genuine. It has the typical mixed-up "wear" typical of Chinese fakes.

There are two simple tests to verify this.

See if a magnet sticks to it. If it does, it's a steel fake.

See how much it weighs, to the nearest 0.1 grams ideally. Genuine coins should weigh around 26.5-27.0 grams; fakes often weigh much less, as the previous posters in this thread have discovered.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
Pillar of the Community
Austria
562 Posts
 Posted 07/28/2014  12:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coinworldtv to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
100% Fake!
New Member
United Kingdom
2 Posts
 Posted 02/23/2015  09:20 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Fluke to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi, Sorry to hijack an old thread but I also have one of these coins, except mine is not magnetic and weighs 26.76g. I cant read Chinese so wouldn't know where to go from here

Very informative forum, new greetings from the UK







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Australia
13853 Posts
 Posted 02/23/2015  9:10 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hello and welcome.

Judging just by the looks of it, I'd be suspicious - the tarnish has the unnatural, "painted-on" look to it, typical of the lower quality fakes.

As for the design, it too has cause for concern. I'm not aware of any genuine Hupeh Province coins that spell the name "He-peh", though given the prevalence of the type with the counterfeiters, it would not surprise me if there was a rare pattern coin with this error. However, doing a Google search for "he-peh province", I can see plenty of fakes being sold with that name (the notorious fake merchant Ali the Barber is currently selling fakes just like this for $3 each) - and plenty of confused people who own them and are trying to find out what they own.

I'm afraid your coin, too, is not genuine.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
Pillar of the Community
Canada
2805 Posts
 Posted 02/23/2015  10:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nalaberong to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Maybe one day, somebody will post a real Chinese dollar?
Valued Member
United States
347 Posts
 Posted 02/23/2015  10:42 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add manymore to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
...I'm not aware of any genuine Hupeh Province coins that spell the name "He-peh"...

China has both a Hupeh Province (Hubei #28246;#21271;) and a Hepeh Province (Hebei #27827;#21271;).

They are not the same province.

The inscription on the OP's coin states that it was made during the reign (1875-1908) of the Guangxu Emperor of the Qing Dynasty.

However, during the Qing Dynasty "Hepeh Province" did not exist. At that time the province was known as "Chihli" (Zhili).

The name of the province changed in 1928 to "Hepeh".

Therefore, any "Qing Dynasty" coin which states "Hepeh" in its inscription must be a fake.

Gary
New Member
United Kingdom
2 Posts
 Posted 02/24/2015  9:13 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Fluke to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
back to doing the lottery then! lol. Thank you for your responses, very much appreciated. seems finding a real Chinese dollar is like finding a needle in a haystack the size of everest with the sheer volume of fakes. I think I will stick with British coins.


I could be back again soon as I have just purchased a job lot of 14kg mixed British and some world coins. only just took on the hobby after disability has forced me to retire really early, the hobby is coin collecting as well as making rings out of coins. The last thing I want to do is punch a hole through the middle of a rare coin and I am sure veteran collectors would seriously frown upon that.

apologies again for the thread Hijacking and waffling on.

Have a great day where ever you are.!

Lee
New Member
United States
9 Posts
 Posted 06/06/2015  10:18 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Mustang71 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Ok...my turn! Is mine authentic?






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