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Bryan1315
Moderator
USA
6807 Posts |
 Posted 11/13/2006 12:37 pm
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I told all of you that I had a 1881-S MS-64DPL in a new ANACS slab coming and when it got here I would crack the coin out and replace it with another coin and take pictures to prove it, well here they are, as you can see there is no evidence of tampering with the slab, and as you can also see, that sure aint a morgan in there anymore
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Tpatna
Pillar Of The Community
USA
1610 Posts |
Posted 11/13/2006 12:47 pm
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Sure enough looks like it was not tampered with....now I will be more skeptical when buying a ANACS slabbed coin.
Tim
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OldDan
Pillar Of The Community
USA
1203 Posts |
Posted 11/13/2006 12:48 pm
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I'm sure you aren't the first one to perfect this method of disposing of unwanted coins. It should make those who insist on buying slabbed coins a little queezie to think this is what had happened with one of their coins in their collection. If you don't know how to grade yourself, you are a sitting duck for just about any caper.
And you have proven what I have said, very well.
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ageka
Pillar Of The Community
Belgium
2078 Posts |
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RangerXLT8
Valued Member
USA
208 Posts |
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Bryan1315
Moderator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted 11/13/2006 1:01 pm
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there is not even a crack in the slab anywhere to show it was tampered with, when I first got my 1909 VDB lincoln cent and realized how easy it was to open the slabs (even though that one did crack because I wasn't trying to be careful at all) I decided I was going to do this with this coin when it arrived (since I had already bought the coin in the new ANACS slab, and I was going to be more careful this time to see how easy it was) I have to admit, the lincoln cent was more flexible than the dollar slab but as you can see still no evidence of tampering at all and all I would have to do is slap another 1881-S Morgan in there and sell it on eBay or yahoo and I could even polish the coin to make it look DMPL if wanted and a unsuspecting buyer that didn't know anything about coins would be fooled because with just a little super glue in a few places it would never even look like anything was wrong and if ANACS says its a DMPL and if its in the new holder it has got to be problem free so they are satisfied with the coin and really they are getting ripped off. Of course I would never do that and that is the reason I am showing how easy it is and how you wouldn't be able to detect it so everyone can be aware that this is a major problem especially if you aren't familiar with the series and dont know what you are buying and you are just going by what the holder says. I hope maybe this will open some peoples eyes and wish I had this proof when Mr. Taylor was here because he said he had never seen proof and he said they took precautions to be sure it couldn't happen, but as you see I did it with very little effort and all within a matter of about 2 minutes
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SuperDave
Moderator
USA
5116 Posts |
Posted 11/13/2006 1:06 pm
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quote:
Originally posted by RangerXLT8
So this can be done for other TPG slabs as in PCGS, NGC, ICG?
No.
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Bryan1315
Moderator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted 11/13/2006 1:09 pm
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quote:
Originally posted by RangerXLT8
So this can be done for other TPG slabs as in PCGS, NGC, ICG?
Most slabs are alot harder to open than the "New" ANACS slabs are, I have had a hard time opening NGC,PCGS slabs and I just use a dremel with a cutting wheel on them because I dont want to mess up the coin inside and they are really hard to open some times, but the new ANACS slab can be cracked open with very little effort and when they are opened there is no evidence that it was ever tampered with which makes the slab worthless for collectors because the main reason for TPG is for authentication and if they can be opened with little effort and the coin changed and then glued back together and you cant ever tell it was tampered with who is to say the person put a real coin back in the slab before they resealed it, so this is a major problem that ANACS needs to fix real soon or their company will suffer more and more because if I can do it and am what I liike to think an honest person, you can bet the not so honest people can do it and chances are already are doing the same thing right under everyones noses
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ageka
Pillar Of The Community
Belgium
2078 Posts |
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Bryan1315
Moderator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted 11/13/2006 1:31 pm
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Someone could change the coin with a coin that was close to the same grade but was a point or two below and it would take awhile for them to be figured out (which is probably what would be done, they wouldn't be so blatant as I was to put another type of coin in there, because they want to fool you, and grading is so objective anyway if they put just missed coins in there who is to say its wrong). Now a 1881-S Morgan is not that big of a deal because the price difference between grades isn't that great if it was changed with a coin that was close to the same grade but just didn't quite make it, but you get into some other coins where one grade means thousands of dollars that is where you start having a major problem
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Toblerone2
Valued Member
USA
67 Posts |
Posted 11/13/2006 1:41 pm
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Someone should probably send this to ANACS - looks to me like their "new" product is inferior to their old one. I've never liked slabs - not because of what happened here, but becuse they put too much distance between me and my coins. They also frequently don't take eye appeal into account, even though a grade might be technically correct. I would think ANACS would want to rectify this quickly. There's little point to having a slab that's not tamper proof, since you can't be sure of what coin's in the slab!
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JeffMo
Valued Member
USA
69 Posts |
Posted 11/13/2006 1:52 pm
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I like this thread. The other forum gave me all kinds of flack about a certain coin being "unslabbed." It was a 1932-S Quarter in AU58 at $350 or $360.
"(041) This link is not allowed by the Staff s sells a RAW coin--this is NOT good as this is a key date coin and it should be graded and slabbed."
The only site that they said has it lower was an "auction" site. If I am not mistaken, I can't go to an auction site and "buy" it. I can only "bid" on it and hope that other people don't outbid me.
They seemed determined to tell me that the friend who recommended (041) This link is not allowed by the Staff to me is getting shafted and that I should buy from the websites that these particular forum members were recommending. It was incredible! In case after case where I did comparisons, they were 100% wrong. They should come to this forum and read this thread.
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Bryan1315
Moderator
USA
6807 Posts |
Posted 11/13/2006 2:53 pm
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JeffMo, I know this site has been mentioned on this site before, but I dont know if you have ever been there and if not you may want to try them out as well to buy from, I am in no way saying anything bad about (041) This link is not allowed by the Staff (I have never done business with them to say either way) but the owner of this site is a very well know in the numismatic community Harlan J Berk and here is his website http://www.harlanjberk.com/unitedstatesco/cnus.asp He doesn't have alot of slabbed coins but he really knows his stuff and I wouldn't hesitate to buy something from him even without a picture of the coin (even though he usually has pictures of each coin on his site) I would buy it on his description alone because every coin I have ever ordered from him has always been exactly what he described and usually out did my expectations of the coin when it arrived. Just another place you may want to check out to purchase coins from if he has something you are interested in
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TLS5933
Pillar Of The Community
USA
1698 Posts |
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Southern Yankee
Pillar Of The Community
USA
788 Posts |
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toast
Pillar Of The Community
Australia
1091 Posts |
Posted 11/13/2006 7:05 pm
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Bryan1315, thank you very much for the warning.
Obviously people are going to switch coins in slabs for profit.
Resubmitting good quality coins and replacing the coins in the slab for one grade lower would hardly be noticed.
Your Eisenhower Dollar in that slab is now worth about $70 to the investor. (at least to those investors who can not tell the difference between an Eisenhower Dollar and Morgan Dollar. LOL )
Proving collectors need to be able to grade their own coins.
Once you have that ability the only reason to pay have it slabbed is to sell it to an investor.
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I have five Morgans at ANACS right now.1891's 92's and 94's.