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Strange British Pound

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New Member

United States
5 Posts
 Posted 02/21/2012  9:40 pm Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add msr to your friends list Get a Link to this Message

I have a number of recent British Pounds just pulled out of loose change when I've visited England (not surprisingly, most are well-circulated). One of them, however, is confusing. It is dated 2000 and has the standard Rank-Broadley portrait of Elizabeth on the obverse. The reverse, however, is not the Welsh Dragon found on the reverse of the 2000 Pound, but rather is the Plantagenet Lions (found on the 1997 Pound with the older portrait and the 2002 pound with the newer portrait). Put another way, it looks exactly like the 2002 pound, but it is clearly and unequivocally dated 2000.





A few more observations:
(1) Under a magnifying glass, the date looks like it might be a double-strike or restrike since the letters are slightly ghosted; none of the rest of the text on the obverse looks like this. The ghosting is not very clear in the scan, but in person, it very clearly looks like 2000 over 2000, not 2000 over 2002.



(2) The other pound coins I have all have standard medallic orientation. The reverse on this coin is more-or-less medallic, but rotated 45 degrees. You can see this in the scans; since the coin is an a 2x2 the relative orientation of the obverse and reverse in the image is not susceptible to accidental rotations.

I simply can't figure out what to make of this. An odd error strike? A really strange counterfeit (would anyone bother to counterfeit a modern pound, and if so, wouldn't you at least get the sides matching?).

Any ideas?

Moved to British forum - Sap

Edited by msr
02/21/2012 9:52 pm
Valued Member
United States
257 Posts
 Posted 02/21/2012  10:55 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add wpd7 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There's a lot of counterfeit pound coins circulating. This may be one.

Given the medley of "errors" on this sample, it's probably a bad counterfeit.
Valued Member
United States
83 Posts
 Posted 02/21/2012  11:12 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add kensho52 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would say definitely a fake. The lettering is quite crude. There is a big problem over there now, and I'm sure one of our UK colleagues can give us much better information than I. I've just read a few things about the problems.
Pillar of the Community
United States
2605 Posts
 Posted 02/21/2012  11:25 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add svslav to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Definitely a counterfeit.

Counterfeit £1 thread.

There's a reference to an article there, and one of the ways to spot a fake is to look for mismatched obverse / reverse.
New Member
United States
5 Posts
 Posted 02/22/2012  12:59 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add msr to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you for all of the information. I really didn't believe counterfeit pound coins would be common enough to end up with one. Good to know.
Pillar of the Community
Australia
9158 Posts
 Posted 02/22/2012  01:26 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I understand from reading elsewhere that lots of counterfeits have been made of these. In addition this, it looks a bit like 'road kill' to me. Perhaps it may have been on a machine shop floor. That 'crack' may just be part of an impression, either from 'road kill', or from the counterfeiting.
Edited by sel_69l
02/22/2012 01:27 am
Pillar of the Community
Germany
795 Posts
 Posted 02/22/2012  01:58 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add augsburger to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Fake as anything, I've seen these.
Valued Member
United Kingdom
210 Posts
 Posted 02/22/2012  03:34 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Anaximander to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
What does it say around the edge?

The 2000 coin should say "PLEIDOL WYF I'm GWLAD". The 2002 coin should say "DECUS ET TUTAMEN".

I suspect that if the counterfeiter even bothered to add the inscription, it will be irregularly spaced.

Yours is clearly counterfeit for three reasons:
poor quality strike ( probably pressure-moulded not struck);
obverse/reverse design mismatch;
obverse/reverse misaligned.

A good counterfeit will be given away by the inscription. Genuine coins have the inscription properly spaced and formed. Also, the base of the inside of the letters is flat-bottomed. Counterfeits have "V"-shaped grooves forming the letters.

It is reckoned the number of counterfeits in circulation is approaching 3%. They are now being produced on an industrial scale!
Pillar of the Community
Australia
9158 Posts
 Posted 02/22/2012  5:57 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Why have so many of these been counterfeited?
Valued Member
United Kingdom
210 Posts
 Posted 02/22/2012  9:10 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Anaximander to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Because they are worth enough to bother. Forging lower value coins is not worth it. Also, because they are much easier to forge than the bi-metallic £2 coins. Lastly, because it funds organised crime, and these kind of people have the resources to make the initial investment in equipment, premises etc
New Member
United Kingdom
30 Posts
 Posted 02/25/2012  5:16 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add bradez72 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
realy looks funny ... but yes fake lol
New Member
11 Posts
 Posted 03/06/2012  3:19 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add james wolfe to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
yes a fake
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