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Lebanon
16 Posts
 Posted 03/13/2012  10:36 am Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add Roy777 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message

Hey guys,

I have never been interested in coins before, but after looking at ancient coins (especially Greek ones) I've decided that I want to start collecting, some coins are just beautiful!

I'd like to share the following 4 coins, sadly the images aren't very clear but I would like to start my collection with them if the prices they were offered to me at are good, so any help would be greatly appreciated! I will upload better images with a proper camera once I buy them. Each of them cost $75 except for the Tetradrachm which costs $450.

















Edited by Roy777
03/13/2012 1:37 pm
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United States
1163 Posts
 Posted 03/13/2012  11:36 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Doucet to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The photos aren't clear enough to make good judgments but I would I would wait a bit before buying if you can, especially the Tetradrachm, and look at a lot of similar coins and compare prices via web sources.

Do you have any descriptions for these coins? Also a picture of both sides of the coins would help to ID them here.

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United States
1163 Posts
 Posted 03/13/2012  11:51 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Doucet to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I didn't see how your obv. /rev. pics related to each other on the 3rd and 4th coins other at first.

The Tyche obv. has the galley rev. Maybe I can find a comparable for that one.
Edited by Doucet
03/13/2012 11:51 am
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 Posted 03/13/2012  1:15 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I strongly agree with Doucet--especially for the Athens owl tetradrachm. Not only are sharper pictures needed, but this is not a coin you should ever buy without a lifetime, money-back guarantee of authenticity--which respected dealers always honor. That's because there are so many copies out there. To give you an idea, go to this link, type in "owl tetradrachm", and you'll see why these coins require an airtight guarantee.

If I were to simply go by the picture provided, I would think this owl tetradrachm is far too nice for that fuzzy picture, because the seller would be motivated to take the best pictures possible to realize the most money for the coin. Personally, I think it would be a mistake to buy this coin from these pictures, hoping it's real. Normally, a genuine coin so well centered and without test cuts would sell for several times that $450.

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United States
13487 Posts
 Posted 03/13/2012  1:18 pm  Show Profile Check echizento's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Based on your pictures there is no way to tell if they are real or not. At those prices I would want to make sure they are legit before I would buy them.
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Lebanon
16 Posts
 Posted 03/13/2012  1:36 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Roy777 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you for the replies guys,

I took the pictures myself, the seller has a small antiques shop in my country, doesn't seem to know too much about coins.

I took the owl coin to a jeweler next door and it weighed 16.82 grams, not sure if that's how much it should weigh because I still don't know what year it belongs to, there have been several coins with owls and from what I've seen each with a different price, can anyone help me with the ID on the correct year?

I also can't seem to find the other coins, although I will edit the first one as I have the reverse duplicated without the front side
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Lebanon
16 Posts
 Posted 03/13/2012  1:38 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Roy777 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Edited the pictures, can anyone give me an ID on the coins?
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 Posted 03/13/2012  1:54 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The third coin with Tyche closely resembles this bronze from Tyre:



Attribution of this coin: Phoenicia, Tyre. Dated Year 238, 112/113 AD. AE 19mm (5.39 gm).

The first coin resembles a tetradrachm from Thasos, Thrace. One side depicts Dionysos, the other Heracles. It's another relatively expensive coin that needs a guarantee of authenticity.



Attribution: ISLANDS of THRACE, Thasos - tetradrachm 168-148 BC. Wreathed head of young Dionysos right)(Herakles standing facing, head left, holding club, lion skin draped over left arm, M to inner left. 32 mm, 16,90 gram.


Quote:
I took the owl coin to a jeweler next door and it weighed 16.82 grams, not sure if that's how much it should weigh because I still don't know what year it belongs to, there have been several coins with owls and from what I've seen each with a different price, can anyone help me with the ID on the correct year?
OK, I better understand about the pictures now--I'm sorry to jump to conclusions. The weight is a little low, but within the range of coins I've seen. Dating of these is done by style, and based on what I can see--the date might be 431-393 BC. It's still hard to say much about the coin from the pictures.
Edited by DVCollector
03/13/2012 5:01 pm
New Member
Lebanon
16 Posts
 Posted 03/13/2012  3:40 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Roy777 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would really like to buy the Tetradrachm, and I think I will stick to silver coins once I start collecting; but there are way too many forgeries out there for me to know whether or not it is real. I will go back tomorrow and get high quality pictures.

Thank you all for your time & help!
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 Posted 03/13/2012  4:18 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Doucet to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Coin #4 is similar to this one. But I can't be sure about the Emperor. There are several with this type reverse.

Severus Alexander, 13 March 222 - March 235 A.D. Caesarea, Cappadocia
Mount Argaeus on altar.

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Lebanon
16 Posts
 Posted 03/14/2012  11:58 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Roy777 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Alright guys, went in again and took proper pictures this time, I can get all these coins for $550, he is also willing to give me a 100% money back guarantee.

What do you guys think? Good deal?

P.S. Id's will be helpful!











New Member
Lebanon
16 Posts
 Posted 03/14/2012  12:56 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Roy777 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I found the 4th coin, seems to be this one although the one I found is in a much better condition, looks like a good buy for $50.

http://www.acsearch.info/search.htm...fr=1&it=1#16
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Lebanon
16 Posts
 Posted 03/14/2012  1:55 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Roy777 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Ahh this is too hard, I don't know how you guys do it! For the 4th coin I know that the Obv. is Laureate and the Rev. is Liberalitas but I can't pinpoint the exact coin all the reverses I find have "LIBERALITAS VIIII" on the back none with Liberalitas AVGV like the one on this coin :(
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 Posted 03/14/2012  3:01 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The large pictures of the first coin help a lot--thanks! This coin could be one of three possibilities: a genuine tetradrachm struck in Athens, a contemporary "imitative" type, struck in another region where these coins circulated, or a modern copy.

While I'm not an expert on these coins, but after studying numerous examples, I believe these coins shared some stylistic rules. Today, we don't think of art as having "rules," but in the ancient world of Greece, Egypt, Mesopotamia etc. these rules were very important to their identity, culture and religion. Below, I've compared a few possible "rules" I've observed on every Athens owl tetradrachm I've seen to details on your coin.

Firstly, compare where the crest meets the helmet on the example I've provided below. You will see that every strand of the crest begins with a "bead"--this is true for every Athens tetradrachm I've seen. On your coin, these beads are absent. Secondly, take a look at how the olive sprig "floats" on the reverse of your coin. On coins I've seen, a single stem continues to the edge of the flan, even on the well-centered example I've provided below.

Based on what I can see, I don't believe this coin was struck in Athens. It's not so much the rougher details as this varies a lot from coin to coin, but it's the omission of specific stylistic elements that has me concerned. Another option may be the coin is an "imitative" owl tetradrachm, struck in ancient times by another city to take advantage of their popularity for trade. Again, I lack the expertise to tell an imitative coin from a modern copy. I would strongly suggest posting the coin to this forum and get a more qualified opinion than mine. Good luck!


Edited by DVCollector
03/14/2012 3:58 pm
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2599 Posts
 Posted 03/14/2012  4:13 pm  Show Profile Check TJsCoins's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add TJsCoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Great observations DV!
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11178 Posts
 Posted 03/14/2012  11:08 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm pretty sure the "LIBERALITAS" coin is a fake. The design is that of a silver denarius of Geta as Caesar, but that coin clearly isn't silver.

Frankly, I'd be worried about the authenticity of all of them. Lebanon is not a country where genuine ancient coins are readily obtainable legally.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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