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1907 Ultra thin planchet large cent - ideas?

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tamarin
Valued Member
Canada
291 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2011  9:07 pm Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add tamarin to your friends list Get a Link to this Message

It's a well circulated 1907 large cent. Feels light as a feather. It has the identical diameter of a regular large cent but its planchet width/depth is a little less than half of a regular cent. The weight difference is immediately noticeable. Any



ideas on how it came about? Are there others reported?

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Canada
1248 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2011  10:46 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hhbkiddo to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
this is something for ZONAD...
he is the expert...
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Canada
153 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2011  06:20 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add R2bR2c to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It's from acid .. either a garage or science experiment, mythbusting concerning coca-cola, or something similar. From time to time, you see these with just about any date ... post-mint.
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Canada
291 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2011  06:50 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add tamarin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hmmm, worth pondering but I don't think it's an acid thing. There's too much of a thickness difference. Too much weight difference without the accompanying and obvious exaggerated corrosion or surface defacement that you'd expect with acid. The reverse shows no diminishment of basic detail appropriate to the wear. The obverse shows more wear and detail decline but it's insignificant. The original planchet was definitely a thin one, something comparable to many of the 1859 issues that were more thin than their already underweight peers of the year.
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Australia
8628 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2011  07:35 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have an uncirculated 1965 British penny that is only 60% of the correct weight.

It is what is known as a 'Mint Sport'. This coin was struck at the Royal Mint in London, before it was re located to Llanstrisant, Wales. A lot of Mint employees did not want to have their jobs moved to Wales. As a form of protest, all sorts of oddball coins were made. These were thrown over the perimeter wall of the Mint to be picked up free by passers by.

My penny is one of those recovered by the public.
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Canada
291 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2011  09:31 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add tamarin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sel, that's a fascinating tidbit. I know mint employees everywhere, especially in the past before the age of msss surveillance, likely got into some mischief but to hear of such activity as a form of protest is new to me. I wish this coin was mint. I really don't know the story behind this one but as far as the acid theory put forward in the previous post, my thinking is this: if I were to take a Canadian large cent and cut it carefully in half, to do the work of acid without the acid itself, to remove the obverse, wouldn't the fresh cut coin be void of an obverse completely? Virtually no detail left at all? This coin is so thin it almost floats when you toss it into the air. That's an exaggeration, of course, but it gets to the nature of what it is.
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 Posted 01/20/2011  1:41 pm  Show Profile Check Zonad's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Zonad to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I agree with the acid theory. It's amazing that the details dissolve equally and the coin retains the almost normal appearance. I think the obverse was the side most affected in this case.
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Canada
291 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2011  1:59 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add tamarin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks, Zonad. You agree with R2C. You both could be right. But as I've mentioned I don't understand how the obverse is still intact at all if the thickness of the coin has been reduced so substantially. As the metal is eaten away by the acid wouldn't the entire obverse disappear as the metal reduction exceeds 50% of the thickness of the coin? I don't understand that aspect. I assume if I cut an Edward large cent in half across the breadth of the coin, separating the reverse from the obverse entirely that the obverse will not be visible at all on the half containing the reverse's details.
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 Posted 01/20/2011  2:59 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
with acid too--I've seen a few, although not this particular series.
The wiry rims and skinny, sharp-edged legends strongly suggest the work of acid--imo.
I don't think a planchet half the normal weight would strike up so equally
Edited by DVCollector
01/20/2011 3:00 pm
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 Posted 01/20/2011  3:21 pm  Show Profile Check biokemist6's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add biokemist6 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
As the metal is eaten away by the acid wouldn't the entire obverse disappear as the metal reduction exceeds 50% of the thickness of the coin?

The acid acts equally on the fields and devices, you will not get a smooth planchet with no detail. The surfaces are porous(most obvious on the obv) and the rims have been thinned, the denticles are about to fall off. A coin struck on an extremely thin planchet would have serious strike quality deficiencies.
ANA R-3151318
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Canada
153 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2011  4:06 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add R2bR2c to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you want to try something that many of us did as kids, just put a large cent (or small one) in a small glass of regular Coaca-Cola (if it still has the same formulation). Seal the top so that it can't evaporate and watch the coin disolve like this one has partially. The side that stays touching the bottom of the glass will either have much more or much less "burn-off" (I can't remember which had the most/least). The coin will still have esentially the same amount of relief that it started with over most of the coin, because the high points and flat fields will eat away at the same rate. The rate will be a thinner, lighter coin with almost as much detail until the end of the experiment .. then it will dissolve altogether. I even did it with a spoon one month .. it takes a while so it's not instantaneous. I think that the 1907 had the acid or solution actually brushed or applied to each side intermitantly .. you normally will get a fully submerged one to get the edges eaten away as well.
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Canada
291 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2011  4:39 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add tamarin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Interesting comments here! Thanks! R2B, I think I'll try the coke thing. It is a strange large cent. The edge of the coin does make you wonder as the rim is smooth and the thickness consistent. Thanks again for the ideas on this one to all who commented!
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United States
1 Posts
 Posted 03/20/2012  4:53 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add teacher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I also have found a Canadian thin planchet, Edwardian large cent. Mine is dated 1910 and is the same exact diameter as a regular issue but about 1/2 the weight and thickness. It also seems to be rim-less with the denticles reaching the coin's edge. The fields behind the bust do seem to have some miniscule pitting that would give credence to the acid theory, but I would like to think it's a thin planchet that got mixed in with the others at strike-up time. Wm
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Canada
291 Posts
 Posted 03/20/2012  6:18 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add tamarin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
We can all hope but I tend to go with general opinion here and defer to the acid theory. If the surface of my coin was more convincing - smooth and coin-like like a regular issue - I might change my mind. But it is a curiosity and one more to prompt conversation when shown.
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 Posted 03/20/2012  10:05 pm  Show Profile Check Wade's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Wade to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
before I even read the other's comments I thought acid etched (more so on the bust side)
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9104 Posts
 Posted 03/20/2012  10:52 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
definitely acid, look how the legends are thinned
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