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norfed?

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Valued Member
United States
67 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2012  11:14 pm Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add hondacobra to your friends list Get a Link to this Message

what do you guys think about norfed rounds? I own a few I bought on eBay and I think they are amazing.
is there a reason why none of the online bullion sources seem to ever even mention them let alone offer them for sale?
ebay seems to be the only possible place to buy them.

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 Posted 03/17/2012  11:35 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Silverhawk74 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looks as if there are three main designs, via the torch, Ron Paul, and the Liberty head. We have a couple of the Liberty heads in our generic selection where I work, as it is just a basic round, but nice low prices....

I also noted some proofs which will of course go for higher price.....

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2003-Americ...em5ae46ce2de
Edited by Silverhawk74
03/17/2012 11:37 pm
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 Posted 03/18/2012  12:44 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add CPC24 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Norfed was shut down by the Secret Service, and their owner put in jail. They put denominations, "Liberty", and "Trust in God" on their rounds. The major dealers don't want to get in legal trouble, so they don't sell them.
Edited by CPC24
03/18/2012 01:01 am
Valued Member
United States
67 Posts
 Posted 03/18/2012  12:52 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hondacobra to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
yea I know the whole story about how the fed conspired to shut him down for daring to create
an alternative currency that isnt a doomed fiat.

the counterfeit claims are clearly fabricated. who would be dumb enough to counterfeit something
with a material that costs several fold more than the denomination your copying?

i was just wundering if investors seem to shun them or not. I personally think they look amazing and
are better looking than any other coin or round I have ever seen.
are these "rounds" that arre in public hands subject to confiscation at any time? I have seen them on eBay
but does anyone know anywhere else that they are available?
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 Posted 03/18/2012  1:23 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Silverhawk74 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
"I personally think they look amazing and
are better looking than any other coin or round I have ever seen."

I have seen a piece or two in the one oz. variety that may be considered a bit more eye catching then those pieces, but to each their own.....

Now if you are just talking basic generic rounds/junk rounds then yeah they are pretty cool for what they are....

However many silver rounds deviate big time from spot price and it would be like comparing the old Studebaker Silverhawk's with a 2012 Ferrari, lol....

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mongolia-20...em256d7fe022


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 Posted 03/19/2012  10:30 am  Show Profile Check traevin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add traevin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I love the design, as well. I have four: (2) $50's, (1) $20, and (1) $10. The $50's were bought at half of their denomination price, the $20 was $30, and the $10 was $20. Essentially, all were bought for a $5-10 over spot, I think. But a lot depends of the engraving. Some are rarer and have a much higher value. The 2008 $20 Ron Paul for instance, went for over $150 in the last two auctions I saw. Norfed used to sell coins in many denominations; but they were, I think, shut down a couple of years ago. It seems the FED did not like the competition, what little there was of it. I didn't think any charges were brought up against the owner, or he won, but I'm far from certain about that outcome. Someone's still selling 2012 Ron Paul's. Don't know if it's the same outfit.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/3-RON-PAUL-...em56491ae527
If you haven't noticed by now, I don't proofread veery well and I apollogize profusely. (;>D
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67 Posts
 Posted 03/19/2012  6:21 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hondacobra to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
i believe the owner is in jail for counterfeiting charges. pretty weak case but when the fed wants
to commit conspiracy they dont care.

i never noticed before that the norfed round looks similiar to the Liberty Dollar although way better. I still dont see how they could take it serious when his "counterfeit" cost more to make than what he is supposedly counterfeiting. thats hardly a way to make a profit lol.

i always thought the Liberty Dollar looks like a decapitated haunted zombie heading floating through the air.


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 Posted 03/19/2012  7:25 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
i never noticed before that the norfed round looks similiar to the Liberty Dollar...

The charge of counterfeiting works when people make paper money that looks just like the real thing. I never thought that the Norfed coins looked enough like official US coins to fool anyone, hence could not be counterfeit.

The bottom line is that the government does NOT like competition. I wouldn't either if I was as incompetent as they are. These coins ARE a competing currency and that is their real crime, as far as the government is concerned. Notice that they did not add fraud charges to this case. They didn't for a good reason. The Norfed coins contain real silver, unlike official US coins, and because of this are REAL money and not the fake junk that the US Mint produces for coins.

Here is a small pic of the reverse of a Norfed $20 silver coin:



Now, I ask you... as fair minded individuals of more than average intelligence... does this look like ANY US coin you've ever seen? No? Then how can it possibly be a "counterfeit"?

Added to that, a counterfeit is worth less than the real thing and that is the reason why people create them. They take something that is worthless and pass it off as something of value. Here, we have the exact opposite of what the government was charging in their court case. Obviously, there were no coin collectors on that jury!
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67 Posts
 Posted 03/19/2012  7:39 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hondacobra to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
its says right in the constitution that only gold and silver shall be money.

the defenders of the constitution like to pick and choose apparently.

dont for a second dare think that inflation due to printing money is not a hidden tax.
you suffer from inflation while the government benefits through devalued debt and increased money to spend.
its a trade off I dont remember agreeing to.
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 Posted 03/19/2012  8:45 pm  Show Profile Check traevin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add traevin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Everyone should read this. I felt like I was in bizarro world while perusing this insanity. How did a jury of his peers convict him on these trumped up charges. It's mind-boggling!

"In connection with the Liberty Dollar business, a federal grand jury brought an indictment against von NotHaus and three others in May 2009,[6] and von NotHaus was arrested on June 6, 2009. VonNotHaus was charged with one count of conspiracy to possess and sell coins in resemblance and similitude of coins of a denomination higher than five cents, and silver coins in resemblance of genuine coins of the United States in denominations of five dollars and greater, in violation of 18 U.S.C. § 485, 18 U.S.C. § 486, and 18 U.S.C. § 371; one count of mail fraud in violation of 18 U.S.C. § 1341 and 18 U.S.C. § 2; one count of selling, and possessing with intent to defraud, coins of resemblance and similitude of United States coins in denominations of five cents and higher, in violation of 18 U.S.C. § 485 and 18 U.S.C. § 2; and one count of uttering, passing, and attempting to utter and pass, silver coins in resemblance of genuine U.S. coins in denominations of five dollars or greater, in violation of 18 U.S.C. § 486 and 18 U.S.C. § 2.[6]

On July 28, 2009, von NotHaus entered a plea of not guilty.[7]

On March 18, 2011, after a 90 minute jury deliberation, von NotHaus was found guilty on various counts, including the making of "counterfeit coins" (resembling legal tender coins).[9][10] Attorney for the Western District of North Carolina, Anne M. Tompkins, described Bernard von NotHaus and the Liberty dollar as "a unique form of domestic terrorism" that is trying "to undermine the legitimate currency of this country."[11] The Justice Department press release quotes her as saying: "While these forms of anti-government activities do not involve violence, they are every bit as insidious and represent a clear and present danger to the economic stability of this country".[12]"
If you haven't noticed by now, I don't proofread veery well and I apollogize profusely. (;>D
Valued Member
United States
67 Posts
 Posted 03/19/2012  11:17 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hondacobra to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Isnt the whole federal reserve system homegrown domestic terrorism? They are plotting against their own citizens.
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3670 Posts
 Posted 03/20/2012  12:24 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Silverhawk74 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Like most of you said above, foolish for the gov to say that was a counterfeit attempt, but they got their attention and that is a bad thing....

My dad always says don't draw any unnecessary attention to yourself, makes big sense....

For example, I drive a gold (mild color little attention, calm colors, makes me think of Pm's, lol) 2001 Toyota tacoma pickup FOUR DOOR, and I putt around like 45 miles per hour average speed, MINUS any loud offensive music or tinted windows (makes one look as if they have something to hide), fancy wheels, red sports car, that draws eyes an attention their way....

These guys above get pulled over as I slowly drive by, as I have been maybe been pulled over twice since age of 16, via passing someone driving like 15 mph on a 400 yard strait away in no pass zone way long ago an wrong tags issue the other time....

And don't forget about the thieves who are looking for way more flashy victims (flashy sports car perhaps), and this flying under the radar theory is never a bad idea, ESPECIALLY when its the feds who's attention you are trying to avoid....

Obviously this also applies to not running off at the mouth about the PM stash to every Tom, Dick, an Harry you encounter on a daily basis as well....
Edited by Silverhawk74
03/20/2012 12:31 am
Valued Member
United States
162 Posts
 Posted 03/20/2012  01:51 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add ZiggyZ to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Coin designs change all the time. Some people have never seen a presidential dollar coin, but will accept it after examination because it says "United States of America" and "$1". Is it really so hard to see why a privately made coin that says "USA" and "$20" is a problem?
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1430 Posts
 Posted 03/20/2012  04:05 am  Show Profile Check traevin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add traevin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Is it really so hard to see why a privately made coin that says "USA" and "$20" is a problem?


I believe the one's I have state, "Not legal tender". But you have a point. People do tend to be pretty oblivious, sometimes.
If you haven't noticed by now, I don't proofread veery well and I apollogize profusely. (;>D
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 Posted 03/20/2012  11:55 am  Show Profile Check biokemist6's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add biokemist6 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
its says right in the constitution that only gold and silver shall be money.


That is a complete misquote of the US Constitution that ranks right up there with the ridiculous notion of "separation of church and state" which in reality is no where to be found in that document.


Quote:
Article. I.
Section. 8.
The Congress shall have Power...To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

To provide for the Punishment of counterfeiting the Securities and current Coin of the United States

No mention whatsoever of gold and silver. However, "gold and silver coin" is mentioned in the US Constitution but it only applies to the States.

Quote:
Article. I.
Section. 10.
No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.

http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/ch...nscript.html


Article 1 Section 8 lays out the powers granted to Congress while Section 10 lays out the limitations placed on the States, the wording has nothing to do with some made-up mandate that all coinage has to be composed of gold and silver. If that was the case, then they have been in violation of the Constitution since 1793 when the first coinage to roll off the presses in Philadelphia was copper cents and half cents
ANA R-3151318
Edited by biokemist6
03/20/2012 11:56 am
Rest in Peace
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 03/20/2012  2:26 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
and silver coins in resemblance of genuine coins of the United States in denominations of five dollars and greater

I'll bite, what US silver coins have denominations of $5 or higher?
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