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Fake silver bullion

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Pillar of the Community
Australia
8900 Posts
 Posted 03/28/2012  7:28 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There was a very large gold fraud that was eventually detected involving tungsten cored gold bars.
The scale of the fraud was nearly half a billion dollars.

In this case, I suspect that gold was poured around a solid tungsten slug.
The bars would have then been officially stamped.
Pillar of the Community
United States
1827 Posts
 Posted 03/28/2012  8:04 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add angel2004 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The way you describe sounds like an inside job to me. Never know there recently was an employee of the US Mint in Philadelphia charged for taking (and I assume replacing the Face value) many many Error coins and selling to a dealer in CA.
Pillar of the Community
Australia
8900 Posts
 Posted 03/28/2012  10:15 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Insiders involved? Sure was!
Pillar of the Community
United States
705 Posts
 Posted 03/28/2012  11:30 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add coinwatch to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
What's amazing about all of this stuff (paper manipulation, salted bars, etc) is how NO ONE EVER gets singled out for responsibility or, heaven forbid, actual punishment. It's just surreal.
Pillar of the Community
United States
1827 Posts
 Posted 03/29/2012  07:47 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add angel2004 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes it is. Look at MFGlobal! No one knows where the transfers of money went? Hardly true the money came out and what is the offset? I guess non paper does this? I understand accounting and the offset is always right there. Sometimes not direct but a trail
Pillar of the Community
United States
1827 Posts
 Posted 03/29/2012  09:36 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add angel2004 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Funny I just read an article on SILVER proof half being included in Some of the 2012 Birth sets from the Mint. Scary way to keep track of silver especially since it was assumed the half would be clad! Anyone have this?
Pillar of the Community
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 03/29/2012  6:57 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I know Ron Paul would like all the gold in fort knox checked and verified.

Indeed... and so would a LOT of US citizens. A THOROUGH audit of the Fed is necessary. In fact, without that, I suggest that the Fed's charter be revoked by Congress in 2013.


Quote:
Look at MFGlobal! No one knows where the transfers of money went?

Well, I think that we all know that this is a lie, er, convenient excuse that is being used to cover some inexcusable actions. For one thing, fiduciaries are required by law to KNOW where their clients' money is at ALL times. It amazes me that the people in Congress, who are questioning various MFG employees, do not seem to know this. If the mid-level employees were grilled well enough and threatened with jail time, a true picture of the actual events would likely emerge. The transfer of $200M from client accounts to a JP Morgan subsidiary in London is a perfect example. Such things do not ever occur without the knowledge, consent, and direct orders of those who run the company. Specifically, that would be the CEO and the CFO. Since it doesn't seem possible to get a straight answer from either the CEO or the CFO, it is the mid-level employees who actually handled the transfers who will know what happened, when, and who ordered it done. Of course, for any of this to be meaningful, we would have to have a justice department that would be interested in obtaining justice. That seems rather scarce at the moment. Perhaps next year?
Pillar of the Community
United States
1431 Posts
 Posted 03/29/2012  10:30 pm  Show Profile Check traevin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add traevin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Of course, for any of this to be meaningful, we would have to have a justice department that would be interested in obtaining justice. That seems rather scarce at the moment. Perhaps next year?


Ed,

As you know, the corruption goes all the way to the top, crosses all party lines, and no one in government has the will or perhaps even the power to do anything about it. The people with the real power are more untouchable and insulated than the core of planet Earth.
If you haven't noticed by now, I don't proofread veery well and I apollogize profusely. (;>D
Pillar of the Community
United States
1827 Posts
 Posted 03/29/2012  10:36 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add angel2004 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It is such a shame what is going on in our country. The Mafia from my childhood seems mild! One at least knew their methods and ideas
Valued Member
United States
50 Posts
 Posted 03/29/2012  10:51 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Polo4121 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Anngel2004 I read the thread about the birth year set w/ silver half. I was mad I didn't buy one like I thought about. Wish they had one last year as my daughter is now 4 months old!
Pillar of the Community
United States
1827 Posts
 Posted 03/29/2012  11:04 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add angel2004 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes I was going to get 2 for a relative expecting twins but would have wanted silver not clad.
Valued Member
United States
376 Posts
 Posted 03/29/2012  11:41 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add silverdollar2011 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Junk silver for the win then? lol
Pillar of the Community
Australia
8900 Posts
 Posted 03/30/2012  12:15 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My scan of Google reveals that about 5,700 gold bars were faked, each of them weighing 400 ounces. some of them were found in the bank of England's vaults, and a greater amount in Fort Knox.

You would expect many conspriacy theories exist on this subject, some of them no doubt set up to obscure the truth.

One of these theories says that the bars actually originated from Fort Knox, and that some gold was sold off to be replaced by the fake bars.

The actual truth may never come out.

The value of 5,700 gold bars, each weighing 400 ounces is around 31/2 to 4 billion dollars. That is minuscule, relative to the U.S. national debt.

Pillar of the Community
United States
705 Posts
 Posted 03/30/2012  01:18 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add coinwatch to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The value of 5,700 gold bars, each weighing 400 ounces is around 31/2 to 4 billion dollars. That is minuscule, relative to the U.S. national debt.


Yes, but the psychological impact is significant.

What I'm not clear on is whether or not these fake gold bars were discovered before or after the creation of the "good delivery" system which (in theory) safeguards the current global wholesale bullion trade. I'm guessing there has to be countless tons of gold bars still out in the world (much of which has sat for years in Central Bank vaults) that have not been re-assayed and certified as "good delivery." Can you imagine a central bank chairman making that gut check? "Do I re-certify the contents of my vault? And do I really REALLY want to know if the gold I claim to have is really there?" This is the kind of thing that must give bankers many sleepless nights.
Pillar of the Community
United States
3670 Posts
 Posted 03/30/2012  01:44 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Silverhawk74 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Another reason I like PCGS or NGC or even ANACS. Real old coins, often toned in very unique patterns....

Could a great con make a fake of the above example in one of the three cases above, probably. But, would it be FEASIBLE or PRACTICAL for the thief to waste their time an stolen money on, again probably not....

I saw a CSI where a kid who was not getting enough attention from his rich father, stole all his high dollar art pieces an replaced them with fakes an artist had replicated to such exactness, they could only tell they were fake via using ultra violet light perhaps, or something along those lines....

My point being, heck even if a crook did take the time an money to figure out a way to fake the items I have been adding lately, the odds of me or anyone else ever realizing they are fake is slim to zero, lol. Short of cracking set item open an testing it there after, an who would do that, not I on a whim....

I took that Worlds fair coin to work today to make sure it was real silver, as it has no stamping of any kind indicating it is .999 or silver for that matter. But it past the magnet test with flying colors and I rubbed it on the rock via the rim, and it tested real blue with the acid we use to test 18K or sterling, and it weighed spot on....

Here is the cool part, I searched high an low looking for another and found one just like it on eBay, small picture no toning or case, but listed at 15 bucks, 5 more shipping an best offer as a METAL coin, lol.....

I have been looking high an low for months for a pure piece of 1 oz. silver at a ridiculous low chance, an there it is as I bet one could offer him 10 bucks an he would take it, rof....
Edited by Silverhawk74
03/30/2012 01:49 am
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