Ebay Is Such A Wasteland Of Counterfeit Junk!

I read that auction description twice and can't figure out if it is a contemporary counterfeit, a modern one or what.
The seller cancelled it anyway though.

People have been bothering for a response but like Judd indicated in the end it's indeed a modern Chinese fake. When I first posted the example I thought the same thing but it had precious metal impurities (silver, gold and platinum) which I had never seen before in a Fe/Ni alloy composition so to me it was an oddity more than an off-metal error and I felt it was worth posting. On U.S ebay you really can't indicate the words: forgery, counterfeit, non-regal or contemporary. In Canada and Europe you can ... to me this was an oddity more than an off-metal error so I responded in this fashion to several E-Mails in this way in the beginning. Currently I am assembling a world class collection of contemporaries which are coins that co-circulated with the legitimate pieces during the same time periods as their regal counterparts. My collection includes pieces from the 12thC to around 1850. At this point I am convinced that the best Silver Type Coin Chinese counterfeits are made in three basic alloys based on confirmed XRF analyses: German Silver, Iron/Nickel and Brass with small percentages of silver intentionally added which makes the appearance look like silver. This is why on Steve Caruso's site (Black Cabinet) you see on these transfer cast process pieces of Morgans, Trade dollars and now this 1878 Golloid (ooops) with the same features such as the raised metal dots, irregular surfaces on the motifs (i.e., lettering) due to the coin breaking away from the mold and metal fall-out from certain outer rim areas occurring from the same event. This also explains why some are magnetic and some not magnetic based on Steve's investigations.

This coin had no chance of entering the sniping stage after realizing that the impurities meant nothing for this piece but it was interesting on the comments received from both error and high Federal collectors and in the end prior to canceling this lot I confirmed that the trace metals such as silver, gold and platinum came from the refining of the iron or nickel based on further analyses with this piece in the laboratory - some were calling this piece everything from junk to a highly collectible counterfeit. How did I acquire it Judd? Purchased it from a dealer in England from a small blurred out photograph? Some people consider all casts and counterfeits junk. Today several hundred people will pay more for a copper English Contemporary Counterfeit halfpence or farthing than a regal piece from England from the 17th-19th centuries. Sometimes based on how crude these pieces are the pay out is as high as 100X compared to a Spinks regal price recommendation.

A U.S. Colonial Vermont Ryder 5 in CAST today could bring over $10,000 at a Stacks auction. The list goes on and on ... I will be coming out with two books that address many of these counterfeits including how the Chinese made counterfeits for the most popular world coin collected today - The Portrait 8 Reales. After these two projects I was thinking of coming out with a U.S. Federal/World book on contemporaries - I am not sure if Mr. Caruso can assist me with this project that I am sure the American Numismatic Society would like to publish. There seems to be enough interest in the purchase and/or the AVOIDANCE of counterfeits and what is a GOOD or BAD purchase in this last frontier of American and World Numismatics ...

Colonialjohn, I'm not an Amazon seller, so I don't know if this will help you. BUT, have you considered trying to sell on Amazon? They've become less draconian than ebay (and more practical than they were in early years, when Amazon was barely functional) in the last few years, and if your specialty is in selling counterfeits as counterfeits, you may find a more welcoming audience there. A quick search for "counterfeit coin" from the Amazon homepage just showed me two fakes being sold upfront as fakes right on my first page of results, so it looks like Amazon has no problem with fakes as long as the seller is honest about what they are. I think the big problem people had here was that it looked like this coin was being presented as real, when it's not (and ebay is not on the right side with this, fakes should be allowed to be sold as fakes as long as they're clearly marked as such, but unfortunately what we think doesn't change their policy).


And please, please, PLEASE, don't use that blue and white striped background anymore. I'm not a graphic design student or professional, but as I mentioned elsewhere in this thread, I did study the subject informally on my own when my mom had her own ebay business, and that background is absolutely no help to you or your potential buyers--it makes it hard for the buyer to read and thus looks like you have something to hide. If you'd like a framework to outline and justify your text, a solid box in a light, subtle colour (lavender is an excellent choice for this--it's a very light but warm colour, which stimulates the eye and draws it in a natural pattern across the field without distracting it) or a box that's just an outline will suffice. It doesn't need to look like you have a five-million-dollar marketing team, just like you took a look at the ad from a buyer's perspective and saw what would make it easy and attractive to read. (Sorry--I was a theatre major in college and got inundated with even more colour theory and spacial awareness theories there than I did when studying graphic design, this is a thing of mine.)


And a final note, I'd be interested in this book on contemporaries. I'm pretty sure I've gotten a couple of fakes in my drawer at work before that went beyond the occasional joker trying to slip me a car wash token. It would've been nice to know if they were junk to be passed on, or worth saving.

Usually it does not get the same sophisticated buyers as E-Bay. Even Delcampe auctions has a few top English/French dealers but E-Bay is #1 with most top contemporaries selling at ebay US UK Spain and France ... this was just an unfortunate lesson with these annoying very well made Chinese transfer casts ... I do feel for the beginner collector or people trying to get a bargain on a RAW coin and putting it into a slab. This is a major part of collecting ... I still have a pretty good following of loyal buyers but I do buy alot more than I sell ... which is not very often ... maybe two coins/month.

Steve - absolutely. But sometimes you need to pay attention to trace elements. I would consider any 90% silver coin without trace gold to probably be counterfeit - at least from the 19thC & 18th Centuries. Have not XRF much 20thC Federal pieces. My offer sill stands to analyze some of your coins you post on your site to give them better alloy descriptions.

heres another--shattered die? I dont think so.......

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1905-Libert...em4169919d82

If it was a shattered die the 'cracks' would be raised rather than incuse wouldnt they? I think its just had a hard life.