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 Replies: 21 / Views: 2,351 |
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5402 Posts |
No such thing as Natural or Artificial Toning with the grading companies ..... The New reality , MARKET ACCEPTABLE toning . Your coin is pretty , but the TPG was just covering their bases! You can get this kind of look on Eagles , Maples and 1 ounce Bars , just by having them in contact with wooden surfaces or surfaces with high sulphur content . We have a wooden cabinet that had two Canadian Maple Leaf Silver coins laying on top . Developed funky colours I have never even Knew existed ! Toned naturally from the wood , but I would guarantee NOT market acceptable ! |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1667 Posts |
"what I got back was "Questionable Color"....Is it, or isn't? If the experts don't know, then who." it is "questionable color" meaning likely artificially toned, meaning they will not grade it. They gave you their opinion, and that's what you paid them for, their opinion of the coin. As far as the return packaging goes, they have those cardbord boxes for less than 10 slab submission returns now, and they usually use them for less than 5 coins so they can put the slips and returned materials in there also. If it's close to 10 or more they use the 20 coin plastic boxes still. They don't "charge" you for the slab holder they return orders in beyond whatever they charge in their submission fees. You don't pay extra for a 20 coin plastic holder or a 10 coin cardbord slab holder either way. Personally I kind of like the 10 slab box, it also takes NCG holders and will close still. Where do you go from here? you've got a coin in a slab with questionable color on it. If you don't like it you could crack it out, dip it properly and try resubmitting it, OR sell it as is in the slab, or crack it out and sell it as a super toned SAE like the coin cookers do on ebay. Or keep it. the third party graders give you an opinion for the price they charge, that's what they did. Agree or disagree with their opinion, that's up to you, but they did their job which was give you a professional opinion. Edited by Big-Kingdom
02/10/2021 11:54 am
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
5192 Posts |
@Believe7,
did you buy this coin from Mike's Mountain Values?
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
701 Posts |
@NumisEd...I got these here locally in southern CA.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
701 Posts |
@BigKingdom, I've been a member of PCGS for a few years now and I've never received, a cardboard box.
Own at least 6 of the real deal, must be hard times.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
701 Posts |
@PACIFICCOINS...Thanks for the info, gives me peace of mind.
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Valued Member
United States
271 Posts |
I can see PCGS not grading questionably toned coins or factoring in legitimate toning. If they provide a guarantee of value, they likely want to judge things that won't change and the origins are known, like date or mint mark. I wonder if they can be sued for making a determination of variable to unusual features without a large reference sample of similar coins to guide them with toning?
Stay well,
Diy89Nurm7
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Pillar of the Community
United States
8938 Posts |
@Believe, PCGS has switched to cardboard boxes due to a shortage of the plastic boxes. Their manufacturer is unable to produce and as such they have temporarily transitioned.
@Diy, they can't. Because the value of toning is subjective they will never assign a value to a toned coin beyond that of an untoned coin.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5248 Posts |
"Questionable colour"
In the CCF there have been many discussions of the possible subjectivity of grading, but there are written standards and pictures to use as a standard. With toning it seems there is no agreed upon method to determine artificial vs natural, so it seems sensible now to avoid giving an opinion. "questionable" to me means that it is too subjective for experts to give an opinion one way or the other.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
701 Posts |
@GRAPECOLLECTS...BUT NO SHORTAGE ON THE FEES, they should at least let you know whats going on...you'd think.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
19968 Posts |
Quote:
No such thing as Natural or Artificial Toning with the grading companies .....
The New reality , MARKET ACCEPTABLE toning .  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
8938 Posts |
I'm not sure what you mean by "let you know", it'd be impossible for PCGS to try to justify in writing why every coin is given the grade it is.
Personally I believe the coin has been artificially toned.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
701 Posts |
@Grapecollects...what I was trying to say is that their fees remain the same with cardboard or non cardboard.
This stuff is not cheap, I'm sure you're aware.
We live and we learn daily.
Your input and everyone else's is well appreciated. Thanks coin community, what will I do without you
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21788 Posts |
I rather like the idea of "Market Acceptable Toning".
Like most, I do like the appearance of nice rainbow toning, irrespective of how it may have happened.
Because rainbow toning can be unstable over time, I really prefer blast white for MS++ silver coins.
In both cases, air tight preservation is ideal.
Nevertheless,
because of the problem for myself of not being able to establish with 100% certainty if (especially) rainbow toning is artificial or otherwise, I have never ascribed any extra value that nice eye appeal due to toning may confer on a coin.
I fully agree with PCGS "Questionable Color - UNC Detail"
What impact that may have on an intending buyer is entirely up to that individual - not the seller.
For me, those who attempt artificial toning are just wasting their time, and are risking what may have been a beautiful coin by botching the process and not adding any extra value if they are successful.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5833 Posts |
Uncertain whether how close is from these pictures to the color of the actual coin, but if it what I see from my monitor, its not like some other coins I prefer. Although from my current perspective this doesn't look natural to me either.
Edited by macmercury
02/25/2021 8:37 pm
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First Page
Posted 02/10/2021 11:52 am
