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1999 P Lincoln Cent Retained Struck Though Or Damage?

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 Posted 08/04/2022  8:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dearborn to your friends list
I would think if this incuse mark would not have a 'wave' of metal if it occurred while being struck. The die would keep the surrounding area unaffected. Now if it happened after it left the mint, I would expect to see some movement of the metal.
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 Posted 08/04/2022  8:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wrekkdd to your friends list
The color from the close up makes it much harder to judge. Normally here I would say struck through but I'm going to say it's coincidental PMD.

A close up with a much less grey lighting to show weather the zinc is exposed in the event in question.
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 Posted 08/04/2022  9:59 pm  Show Profile   Check -makecents-'s eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add -makecents- to your friends list
Alright, in the last post I made, I think I answered my own question. The fact that it's raised, leads me to believe it happened after the strike of the die, it would be level, if it were a retained strike through or as Yokozuna said, almost so, so the fact that it's raised, makes me believe it happened post strike, PSD.

Yokozuna, I did do the toothpick test, after you told me to, can't believe I did not think to do this before, I amaze myself sometimes.... Nothing happened but I was taught a few years ago, that this does not mean it is not a plating issue, just not a plating bubble, it can be solid and is what I think this is. The shape just threw me off. I added a pic to show after the toothpick. I pressed directly on the "S" and between the "D" and "S" and again between the "S" and "T". Nothing gave.

Dearborn, I'm not quite following your statement but it is not incuse, it is in relief and that's the rub. By the way, I had not congratulated you on your 10,000th post, congrats! Thank you for all of your valuable input, I've always appreciated it.

Wrekkdd, I have enjoyed watching how quickly you have picked up on so much, in a very short time, you are a sharp individual. I have not figured out how to get true color from my scope and it looks even worse if I try to color it after the fact. I think there may me some zinc showing through, very little but I think it's there. Good call though.


1999-P-Lincoln-Cent-Retained-Struck-Though-Or-Damage?
-makecents-
Edited by -makecents-
08/04/2022 10:08 pm
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 Posted 08/05/2022  08:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dearborn to your friends list
I was refering to Yoko's post at 5:27 about the 'wave' on the coin.
I also missed that this feature was raised. at first look, it looked incused to me.
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 Posted 08/05/2022  11:19 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list
It looks like a wire or a clean bristle that was struck onto the coin.
1999-P-Lincoln-Cent-Retained-Struck-Though-Or-Damage?
1999-P-Lincoln-Cent-Retained-Struck-Though-Or-Damage?
1999-P-Lincoln-Cent-Retained-Struck-Though-Or-Damage?
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 Posted 08/05/2022  11:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petespockets55 to your friends list
The raised area isn't flexing or depressing downward.
Why couldn't it be a long die gouge?

ps.
What is the Die State on this one, MDS?
And what's up with BER on the obverse? Broken post on the B and maybe the R?
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 Posted 08/05/2022  1:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add HGK3 to your friends list
Nice curving, arcing shape to the raised feature, reminiscent of a struck through a rim burr, but raised. Is it possibly a die gouge caused by dropping one die onto another or bumping two dies at a slight angle? I can see a dent or gouge shaped like this being formed if just the arced edge of one die contacts the other.

When striking planchets after this incuse dent on the gouge would leave a raised "welt" (for lack of a better word) on the coin.

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 Posted 08/05/2022  3:10 pm  Show Profile   Check -makecents-'s eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add -makecents- to your friends list
Thanks for checking it out, coop! Where it's raised, well above the fields and devices, after Yokozuna got me thinking correctly, a struck through or even retained struck through, didn't fit.

Petespockets55 and HGK3, I think you guys are correct, not sure why I did not think of that. It's the perfect shape of a die dent and would explain why it tapers at the ends. I think you guys have solved this one for me, just was not thinking correctly from the start.

Petespockets55, I'll take a closer look at the other items you asked about this evening.

Thanks for all the input, everyone!
-makecents-
Edited by -makecents-
08/05/2022 8:30 pm
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 Posted 08/05/2022  4:57 pm  Show Profile   Check -makecents-'s eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add -makecents- to your friends list

Quote:
ps.
What is the Die State on this one, MDS?
And what's up with BER on the obverse? Broken post on the B and maybe the R?
Looks to be LEDS to EMDS. Tried to show some flow lines in the pics. Part of LIBERTY was just damaged. Thanks again for heading me in the right direction on this one.


1999-P-Lincoln-Cent-Retained-Struck-Though-Or-Damage?
-makecents-
Edited by -makecents-
08/05/2022 8:31 pm
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 Posted 08/05/2022  5:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cujohn to your friends list
Sure looks like it's recessed to me. Looks like stuck through maybe a wire. If it is above the surface, then it would be a die crack and I would think there were more of them out there. And I've never seen a die crack looking that perfectly round and straight.
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 Posted 08/05/2022  5:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wrekkdd to your friends list
Sorry, I definitely missed something as I thought the event was incuse from the pictures. If it's raised I'll have to run my mind around it a bit. So if it's raised there will be more examples out there!!!if this is the retained struck through or if it's a die rent there will be sister coins out there. Always fun to try and find a matching pair of errors. I stay away from zinc personally:)

Also I appreciate the nice comment
@-makesence-, I have been more focused in learning in the little spare time I have had rather then posting my own coins...why ask questions when the answer is easy to find.
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 Posted 08/05/2022  8:41 pm  Show Profile   Check -makecents-'s eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add -makecents- to your friends list

Quote:
Sure looks like it's recessed to me. Looks like stuck through maybe a wire. If it is above the surface, then it would be a die crack and I would think there were more of them out there. And I've never seen a die crack looking that perfectly round and straight.
It is well above both the fields and devices and if it were a retained strike through, it would be mashed flush or very close to being flush, from the strike of the hammer die. I was figuring things out, as this thread went on, I just didn't have the right thought process from the beginning.
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 Posted 08/05/2022  8:48 pm  Show Profile   Check -makecents-'s eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add -makecents- to your friends list

Quote:
Sorry, I definitely missed something as I thought the event was incuse from the pictures. If it's raised I'll have to run my mind around it a bit. So if it's raised there will be more examples out there!!!if this is the retained struck through or if it's a die rent there will be sister coins out there. Always fun to try and find a matching pair of errors. I stay away from zinc personally:)

Also I appreciate the nice comment
@-makesence-, I have been more focused in learning in the little spare time I have had rather then posting my own coins...why ask questions when the answer is easy to find.
I do agree that there should be more out there, if it is indeed a die gouge or what I think at this point is a die dent, maybe they have just been overlooked. At this point, it's the best fit, in my opinion.

I had just noticed your thought process and examination, with very detailed responses to different topics, lately. You have definitely been paying attention and reading up on different things, very impressive. Just nice to see someone new to coins, taking the time to understand, not just keep spouting out things.
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 Posted 08/05/2022  8:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list
Note on your image, the raised and fields are affected equally, meaning there was something in the chamber besides the planchet. S stronger and distinct size was there that altered the strike. Just like a piece of wire during a strike.
1999-P-Lincoln-Cent-Retained-Struck-Though-Or-Damage?
Note the wire left a rounded trench because of the wire shape.
A cut on a coin will affect the coin differently. The trench will show a flat bottom and sometimes showing sometimes striation lines on the bottom of the trench.
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 Posted 08/05/2022  8:58 pm  Show Profile   Check -makecents-'s eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add -makecents- to your friends list
I'm not following, coop....
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