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PCGS And CAC Incorrectly Graded My Coin

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Valued Member
Canada
191 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  11:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add recollector to your friends list
I have asked around to some other auction houses and they say that at any time in the future, if a coin is challenged by the buyer and it turns out to not be what PCGS or NGC said it was, the original seller is on the hook for that, regardless of when that is. So 20 years from now, if your consigned coin was found to be fake or graded incorrectly, you had better still have the money you won from it.

Incidentally, if anyone on here knows how to get great collecions to read and respond to their emails I would like to know the trick. ive asked them 3 times since my last posting here to tell me which of my consigned coins that sold a while ago correspond to 2 bank account deposits and got no reply. quite a piece of work this company.
Valued Member
United States
202 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  12:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add apcol258 to your friends list
You could try posting your experience over at the PCGS forum as well. If what you say about auction sales never being final is true, I think that people should be aware of that.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
12057 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  6:13 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add paralyse to your friends list
20 years later? I'd be getting legal counsel involved at that point if it were me, but you don't seem to be located in the US if your forum location is correct so you may not have standing to bring any legal action against any US auction houses, and the transaction will be governed by the laws of whichever state said auctioneer is incorporated in (usually Delaware for US companies.) GC and other auction houses might also have binding arbitration clauses as part of their agreements, and that could be a factor as well.

If that happened to me, and an auction house came back and said "hey, PCGS was wrong about this coin that we sold for you 20 years ago, give me $1000 back" they could forget about me ever paying them a thin dime. Let them send it to collections, I'll dodge it until the statute runs, or they can waste a ton of money trying to sue me, and I'll have my "of counsel" tie them up for just as long with all sorts of thrillingly expensive legal gymnastics.

Obligatory "I'm not a lawyer" disclaimer.
Member ANA - EAC - TNA - SSDC - CCT #890

"Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done." -- Louis D. Brandeis
Edited by paralyse
04/15/2024 6:20 pm
Pillar of the Community
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Canada
9862 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  6:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DBM to your friends list
I don't understand why the OP thinks he is entitled to profit from someone else's mistake.
GC may be holding it for ransom, but he was still the owner of the coin.
"Dipping" is not considered cleaning...
-from PCGS website
Edited by DBM
04/15/2024 6:41 pm
Bedrock of the Community
United States
12057 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  6:44 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add paralyse to your friends list
I don't understand why anyone thinks that an auction house does not have a duty to its buyers and sellers to resolve such concerns prior to completing the auction and sale of an item and transferring funds respectively. The time for the auction house to resolve this issue was prior to the funds being paid out to the seller and deducted from the buyer (or from the auction house's item escrow account for the purchase in question, if selling by escrow.)

The mere thought that an auction house could actually try to charge me back if THEY missed an obvious error resulting in misrepresentation when listing and selling an item is quite chilling. This is the reason why errors & omissions insurance policies exist: to indemnify the auction house against financial losses incurred due to inadvertent misrepresentation. The auction house absolutely should own up to its failure to perform reasonable due diligence and make the buyer whole while writing off the loss instead of attempting to recoup it from the seller.
Member ANA - EAC - TNA - SSDC - CCT #890

"Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done." -- Louis D. Brandeis
Valued Member
United States
202 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  7:43 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add apcol258 to your friends list

Quote:
GC may be holding it for ransom, but he was still the owner of the coin.


When does his ownership end? 30 days? 1 year? 50 years?
Bedrock of the Community
United States
12057 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  8:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add paralyse to your friends list
As far as I'm concerned his ownership ends as soon as he no longer has a legal right to possess the merchandise and has received consideration in return.
Member ANA - EAC - TNA - SSDC - CCT #890

"Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done." -- Louis D. Brandeis
Valued Member
United States
361 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  9:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add One50 to your friends list
This topic isn't dead yet?
Bedrock of the Community
United States
12057 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  9:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add paralyse to your friends list
If you're not interested in it, why bother reading it?
Member ANA - EAC - TNA - SSDC - CCT #890

"Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done." -- Louis D. Brandeis
Valued Member
United States
361 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  9:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add One50 to your friends list
It amazes me how many views and comments it's getting. It seems more like a politics discussion (or argument) than a coin learning experience.

That's all, just an observation and a little light hearted humor.
I'll stay quiet on the rest of this one.
Pillar of the Community
Taiwan
606 Posts
 Posted 04/16/2024  12:13 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Everest to your friends list
If anyone is still interested the coin was relisted at GC and sold on 14 Apr for $500.62.
Pillar of the Community
United States
2023 Posts
 Posted 04/16/2024  12:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Alpha2814 to your friends list

Quote:
ive asked them 3 times since my last posting here to tell me which of my consigned coins that sold a while ago correspond to 2 bank account deposits and got no reply.

Is that information not shown at "Items Sold" (https://www.greatcollections.com/Sell/Sold) or "Consignor Statements" (https://www.greatcollections.com/Co...orstatement) under your account?
Valued Member
Canada
191 Posts
 Posted 04/17/2024  05:19 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add recollector to your friends list
the consigner statements show which coins sold and how much was paid for each consigner statement. but for bank account disbursements, they don't correspond one to one. for example, there isn't one deposit for one consigner statement, they pool the statements if there are many coins sold in a short period of time.

but there is no accounting for which consigner statments specifically are for which bank deposits. ive tried to add up the consigner statements in different combinations to see if it makes sense but I can't work out the math. so I asked 3 times which consigner statements correspond to which bank deposits. its not an unreasonable request to want to know which coins are for which bank payouts.

moreover, I received no grading fees invoices. at least heritage sends invoices showing what was graded and their cost. the only indication I got saying how much grading fees for my previous submissions were was when the guy who was instructed to tell me what happened with the 1866 coin 9 months after it happened told me how much the fees were in the body of his email.
Valued Member
United States
104 Posts
 Posted 04/21/2024  4:50 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Benny w to your friends list
I need to read the fine print since just renewing my pcgs membership but I'm thinking that PCGS is definitely on the hook or should be on the hook for this as others have also mentioned. Also, if this is the case, shame on the auction house for not representing you in this regard. At least that's my first reaction.
Valued Member
Canada
191 Posts
 Posted 04/23/2024  05:34 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add recollector to your friends list
what gets me the most is the flagrant disregard for not even informing me what was going on. they said it was returned in 30 days. but I hear nothing about it from them for 9 months. this despite sending repeated emails about my account. if they informed me as it happened then at least I could have prepared myself for it.

and they still havent learned. I have yet to hear back about this bank deposit clarification request I made 3 times almost 1 month ago. disgusting behavior, and after I sold more than 15 thousand through their auctions. never again.

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