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 Replies: 17 / Views: 3,318 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1359 Posts |
Is rotation but this one would be only around 95 degree CCW rotaion. Once it gets up to 180 degree rotation,you have to measure it from the other side. So instead of being around 265 if coming around CW it will be 95 CCW.
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Moderator
 United States
16679 Posts |
Nice find! Not very common.
swcoin.ecrater.com
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Valued Member
 United States
184 Posts |
Quote:
Kloccwork419 Is rotation but this one would be only around 95 degree CCW rotaion. Once it gets up to 180 degree rotation,you have to measure it from the other side. So instead of being around 265 if coming around CW it will be 95 CCW I did a little searching (not much) and can find nothing on how to tell die rotation. So besides using a protractor to measure the rotation, how do you determine whether the die rotation is CW or CCW? And I am intrigued about measuring the obverse if rotation is over 180 deg anyone with info on this would be greatly appreciated, just lead me to the books, I can read  (sometimes as long as the words are less than 5 letters) if the explaination is too long to post. Kie |
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Rest in Peace
United States
1943 Posts |
Try rotateddies.com
Edited by pyrbob
10/11/2009 10:45 am
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
62064 Posts |
U.S> Business strike (Proof coins) should all be 180 different from side to side. Medals are exactly the same on both sides. (Metal setup so the coin will be held by the center top and both edges showing the same direction in the up right position.) Canadian coins are in this alignment between the dies. So by flipping a coin held in hand, the U.S. Coins would need to flipped top to bottom to view both edges in the up right position. Medal aligment you would flip right to left to see both edges in the normal position. The coin above should have the level edge of the bottom of the Montecello level to be normal. The coin above is rotated 95 degrees counter clockwise. (CCW) If the coin were rotated 180 degrees, the direction would not be noted. Rotated in the direction of the clock would be clockwise, (CW) which the coin above isn't. Hope the helps?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1359 Posts |
Exactly. They say that over 15 degrees would be concidered rotation and everything 0-15 is just normal. Once its 15-180 degrees in either direction, it will be CW or CCW. If its 180 degree rotaion, it wont have CW or CCW, it will just be 180. Because theres NO WAY of knowing if the die was rotated CW or CCW, they stop it at 180. So instead of being a 270 degree CW rotation, it would be 90 degree CCW. Thats just how they do it becuase nobody really knows for sure in what direction it really happened. So the blue arrow will be your real rotaion in a CCW direction. Not the area scibbled out  Edited by Kloccwork419
10/11/2009 11:23 am
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Valued Member
United States
184 Posts |
Quote:
prybob Try rotateddies.com excellent website put it on my favorites and submitted photos to him to add to his list thanks for the info. Quote:
coop U.S> Business strike (Proof coins) should all be 180 different from side to side. Medals are exactly the same on both sides. (Metal setup so the coin will be held by the center top and both edges showing the same direction in the up right position.) Canadian coins are in this alignment between the dies. So by flipping a coin held in hand, the U.S. Coins would need to flipped top to bottom to view both edges in the up right position. Medal aligment you would flip right to left to see both edges in the normal position. The coin above should have the level edge of the bottom of the Montecello level to be normal. The coin above is rotated 95 degrees counter clockwise. (CCW) If the coin were rotated 180 degrees, the direction would not be noted. Rotated in the direction of the clock would be clockwise, (CW) which the coin above isn't. Hope the helps? As usual coop you are a fountain of info, I misinterpreted Kloccwork419's post as far as going beyond 180deg. I now see the light. Kie |
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Valued Member
United States
80 Posts |
Actually you all wrong, the reverse is fine. It is the obverse that is rotated!
Just kidding.
Nice find!!!
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1359 Posts |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
{quote]Actually you all wrong, the reverse is fine. It is the obverse that is rotated![/quote]
You could very well be correct, there is no real way to know which die is oriented wrong. And usually on madern coins the dies haven't really rotated at all. The positioning flat ground on the side of the body of the die has been ground in the wrong place.
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Valued Member
United States
314 Posts |
Are you sure this is not a Magician's coin that someone carved out. I had a half dollar like this and you could see where the person cut along the edge's of the reverse and rotated the reverse of the coin. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10284 Posts |
That is an ideal rotated die, 180 degrees would be perfect. I doubt it is a Magicians coin because it would have been most likely a double headed or double tailed coin. I have no idea what this might be worth but I have never noticed one myself this dramatic in my coin searches. |
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Valued Member
United States
184 Posts |
Quote:chris1222nascar Are you sure this is not a Magician's coin that someone carved out. I had a half dollar like this and you could see where the person cut along the edge's of the reverse and rotated the reverse of the coin. I have looked at the entire coin with a 16x loop and I could find no indication of it being 2 coins joined together, I am pretty sure it is authentic. Quote:
condor101 You could very well be correct, there is no real way to know which die is oriented wrong. And usually on madern coins the dies haven't really rotated at all. The positioning flat ground on the side of the body of the die has been ground in the wrong place. New learning opportunity  I love these. So am I to understand that the flat on the die being ground on the wrong spot causes most of these on moderns, and if so that would mean there could literally be thousands of this exact same coin out there waiting to be found. I was under the impression that most of the rotated reverses came from the die jiggling out of the holder( I think I read that somewhere and haven't verified it yet as it is not in my notes). Kie  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2738 Posts |
Judging from multi-error coins in which the rotating die can be ascertained, it is the hammer die that is almost always responsible. That is contrary to longstanding expectations, but expectations are often wrong.
Rotated die errors can be dynamic or they can be fixed. Or you can have a series of dynamic rotations followed by a series of fixed rotations, and vice versa.
Rotated die errors can arise from:
1. A die that becomes loose.
2. A die that is installed wrong.
3. A die that becomes loose and is tightened back up in the wrong position.
4. A die on which the "flat" is ground in the wrong place, which promotes installation in the wrong postion.
It's clear that the shallow flat does not significantly impede rotation.
Error coin writer and researcher.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12437 Posts |
For those wondering what a "flat" is, look on the right side of the die next to the coin  |
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Posted 10/11/2009 09:52 am
