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PCGS Has Damaged My Coin

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basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 04/16/2019  10:01 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
This thread now has a read count of over 25000. I would think the vast majority agree that PCGS is in the wrong;


Doubtful. This thread started 6 years ago, until the recent respondes the last response was really 3 years ago. Very few felt they should pay out more for a submission trying to cheat the system. As has been stated countless times in the thread the coins value was under-declared upon submission. The stated value on the submission form is the max they are required to pay out. It was improperly submitted to pay a lower submission fee and the once in a blue moon even happened and trying to save a few submission fee dollars bit them. It happened so long ago it is completely irrelevant
Edited by basebal21
04/16/2019 10:03 am
New Member
United States
28 Posts
 Posted 04/16/2019  11:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Howard Black to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
"It happened so long ago it is completely irrelevant"

I think you should have prefixed that sentence with "I think" or "In my opinion."

In lieu of that, it leaves me in the awkward position of being wrong, stupid, heretical, or some combination thereof, because I completely disagree.

After I posted my comments, I read the entire thread. It was a nontrivial endeavor for me; I'm "up in years" (man, they sure creep up fast!), in poor health (had my 4th ER visit of the year the day before yesterday and am still on the rebound) -- but I found the material to be anything but irrelevant.

Having read about what happened to this guy I have resolved to strike PCGS off my list of "companies to even consider doing business with." I did not see any resolution to what they did, and their legalese CYA fine-print -- and their doggedly adhering to it -- leaves a foul taste in my mouth and a fouler stench in the air.

The gilding touch was their persistent urging him to send it to them for evaluation so that they could determine whether or not to cover it under their warranty -- and only when the intelligent customer refused to budge until they gave him a number, they finally admitted that if it would be covered, they would pay him the grand sum of $15.

My jaw about struck the pavement when I read that.

What sane customer would even consider forking out a shipping amount in excess of any possible "coverage" -- $15 for a $500 coin they virtually destroyed?

Then yanking the rug from under him by de-certifying it was the coup de gras (minus the "gras" component).

I have no idea what they were thinking...

So, in closing (my final comment in this thread), consider me wrong, stupid, heretical, or whatever. I found the thread to be invaluable, regardless of when it happened. In fact, the length of time that has elapsed without them doing anything beyond pointing at the fine print only makes them look worse IN MY OPINION.
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Conder101's Avatar
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17884 Posts
 Posted 04/16/2019  2:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The USPS specifically limits their insurance liability for coins (and a few other items) to $15, REGARDLESS of how much insurance is purchased.

No they limit their liability for bullion to $15, unless it is sent by Registered mail. Numismatic coins are paid at the numismatic value. They also limit the liability on anything shipped by registered mail out of the country to $49 no matter the declared value.

I think PCGS did exactly the right thing. A claim was made that they damaged the coin. Like ANY insurance adjuster would do they asked to see the item and were refused. So like any adjuster the maximum payment would be the stated insured value which in this case was well less than the pre-damaged value of the item. (If you had a $5,000 item and insured it for a declared value of $1,000 why would you expect to be reimbursed for the full $5,000 value if something happened to it? The max you would get would be the $1,000 it was insured for.)

As for decertifying the coin, they had to. It is still out their in a PCGS holder and they have already settled one claim against it (whether the OP took the money or not). But it remained a potential liability. If the OP sells it to someone else they might try and send it in for grade review with a high declared value and try to get PCGS to make a second settlement on the same coin. Since the OP didn't let them examine the coin and reholder it at its proper grade/condition the only way to protect themselves is to decertify the coin.

I am a strongly anti-TPG person, and I have a particular dislike of PCGS, but PCGS acted properly in this case.
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llewellin's Avatar
United States
1005 Posts
 Posted 04/16/2019  2:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add llewellin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The point is that from a PR perspective, PCGS took the wrong move. It doesn't matter what liabilities are - too often people focus on legal channels and liability, but forget about being good, decent, and honest. When you mess up you make things right.

PCGS severely damaged a rare coin and refused to provide compensation for their mistake because of technical liability. Their business is based on reputation and this was a bad business move.
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basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 04/16/2019  8:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
"It happened so long ago it is completely irrelevant"

I think you should have prefixed that sentence with "I think" or "In my opinion."


It's irrelevant because they are under entirely new leadership. PCGS has a new President from when it happened and CU the parent company has someone else in charge now too. Once leadership completely changes as has the company past leaders decisions become irrelevant.


Quote:
It doesn't matter what liabilities are - too often people focus on legal channels and liability, but forget about being good, decent, and honest. When you mess up you make things right.


It absolutely does matter what their liabilities are. They did exactly what they should have for something that was trying to cheat the system. If you want to try and cheat fees you take the risk that it can backfire and in this case it did as it should have.


Quote:
I think PCGS did exactly the right thing. A claim was made that they damaged the coin. Like ANY insurance adjuster would do they asked to see the item and were refused. So like any adjuster the maximum payment would be the stated insured value which in this case was well less than the pre-damaged value of the item. (If you had a $5,000 item and insured it for a declared value of $1,000 why would you expect to be reimbursed for the full $5,000 value if something happened to it? The max you would get would be the $1,000 it was insured for.)

As for decertifying the coin, they had to. It is still out their in a PCGS holder and they have already settled one claim against it (whether the OP took the money or not). But it remained a potential liability. If the OP sells it to someone else they might try and send it in for grade review with a high declared value and try to get PCGS to make a second settlement on the same coin. Since the OP didn't let them examine the coin and reholder it at its proper grade/condition the only way to protect themselves is to decertify the coin.


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