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 Replies: 24 / Views: 4,212 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5362 Posts |
missinglink You say the following: Quote:My point all along has been that they (the 5 oz ATB coins) are indeed coins. As for legal tender, the 5 oz ATB bullion and collector coins are legal tender as per my reading of this: http://www.treasury.gov/resource-ce...tender.aspx. Where in that website do they mention specific legal tender status as it applies to the 5 ounce commemorative issues of the America the Beautiful series? NOPLACE. Perhaps you need to read this website instead to see that the enabling legislation actually refers to the 5 ounce coins as bullion versions of the America the Beautiful Quarter series. The specific ordinance (law) Public Law 110-456 Dec 23, 2008 can be found here: http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/PLAW-1...0publ456.pdf Here is a page from the US mint website that refers to the coins as having a symbolic face value and being BULLION items on the same page. Therefore my use of symbolic or bullion coin in place of simply coin is a more precise definition. http://www.usmint.gov/mint_programs...sbcInvestorsThe circulating legal tender version of the ABS is the cupro-nickel business strike - that was released into circulation. So I conclude that the US mint and the law use exactly the same definition that I am proposing and not your more loosely defined term. You also seem to equate a precise position on a numismatic definition as: Quote:
rigid-minded ultra conservative types who go into rants
That is a statement that I personally find to be offensive. If I am being "rigid and conservative" by your standard - should I view your all inclusive definition of "coins" as being "lazy and rather sloppy". Perhaps, but not in a fact based discussion between equals. Precision or the lack of precision is what makes us all different and drives discussions of a philosophical nature like this. There is no need to resort to invective language in what is a philosophical discussion.
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New Member
United States
22 Posts |
As a numismatist I usually follow the three category system with my collection. Coins, tokens, medals. To each their own. And although the government has seen fit to give certain bullion coins legal tender status, I do kinda consider them "fake coins" or simply government issued bullion medals. lol
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New Member
United States
22 Posts |
I usually value objects in my collection on a three tiered system. Numismatic value, currency value, or bullion value. So which ever of the three is greatest obviously. I enjoy objects with the greatest amount of numismatic value the most. As to me they have some how transcended beyond their base metal and government issued values, and achieving more then they were meant to be. That makes them kinda special and unique to me. I think most humans appreciate things no matter what they are if it has become greater than its design ever meant it to be by some merit.
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New Member
United States
22 Posts |
One great example is the first gold coin I ever found and purchased. It was a Swiss twenty franc 1949. That particular year they minted many times more than the previous years and by that point in history it was more of a bullion coin, than meant for currency, since gold was at an all time high a couple years ago, I sold it for a very nice profit. I knew that it was valued way more at its metal content than its face value or numismatic value would ever achieve again. And even though it was sentimental to me as my first gold find, I had to let it go because it was at its time, fetching $370 for it. If it had been an earlier date or a key date it's numismatic value coupled with my own sentimental value would have allowed me to keep it in good conscience. But being that it had zero numismatic value and gold was so high at nearly $2000 per ounce it had to go lol. By the way, I found this coin in a dealers world junk bin for only ten cents :)
Edited by Dctjr80
11/25/2014 04:28 am
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1118 Posts |
Gold in a junk bin?!?! Way to go.
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New Member
United States
22 Posts |
Only found one gold coin in six years of searching junk bins, but it was awesome, when I caught sight of it near the bottom of one bin my heart nearly stopped :)
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
701 Posts |
For me its quite simple, A Coin buys whereas a token is exchanged, a medal is won and a medallion is worn. This simple train of thought works for me, I'm not trying to state facts here  As for the original item posted, it is not my area of interest so I wont bother trying to have an opinion on it. Missinglink you should refrain from asking Swamperbob scary questions because his answers may frighten you. |
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Valued Member
Germany
194 Posts |
SAP: Quote:
Even people who consider themselves generalist numismatists and therefore collect all three classes of numismatic item, still want to know the answer to this question. I have a couple dozen "coin albums", ancient, mediaeval and modern, plus a "tokens album" and a "medals album". It therefore matters a great deal to me personally which category an object belongs to, so I know which album to put it in and (perhaps more importantly) so I know which album to go to if and when I want to find that object again.
Point taken! However, as I pointed out, with the advent of non-circulating legal tender issues, we do not have a clear cut separator between coins and non-coins anymore, only varying degrees of "coin-ishness". Which is exactly why mints go through all kinds of hoops to make their merchandise as coin-ish as possible (and will call all their products "coins", regardless of how little coin-ish they may turn out to be). And, as I see it, this is the reason why we have this discussion here. What started out as proof strikes of circulating coins for collectors (or 1804 dollars for presentation sets, if you wish), has now turned into oversized precious metal medallic reproductions of circulating coins or guitar-shaped colored coins from Somalia that have absolutely nothing to do with Somalia at all. I think every collector has to define for him or herself where exactly along this line the coin ends and the medallic item starts. tenbobbit: Quote:
A Coin buys whereas a token is exchanged, a medal is won and a medallion is worn.
This simple train of thought works for me, I don't know what your areas of interest are, but let's just assume for a second it were the "guitar coin" posted above: It neither buys, nor is it exchanged, won nor worn. So what would you call it? |
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
701 Posts |
Hi Dosmundos,
I also stated that I wasn't going to bother having an opinion on the original item posted, no point adding more fuel to the fire.
If people like them then that's their choice, I don't.
As for what I would call it,
Novelty piece.
Nothing to do with coins or numismatics whatsoever.
Its an easy way of collecting, point and click oooh that was quick.
Then you look at how much time and effort some people on here have dedicated to their specialist field, Decades !
I fully understand why these novelty items irk coin collectors, A guitar FFS !
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Replies: 24 / Views: 4,212 |
First Page
Posted 11/24/2014 9:20 pm
