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 Replies: 213 / Views: 42,267 |
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
798 Posts |
New1954, because this is the Canadian NCLT forum.
Yes, Niue, Pobjoy, Franklin, Australia, Palau, Pawnee Nation (sp?), Liberia, all do the same thing.
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Valued Member
Canada
206 Posts |
Here is an article published today in Le Journal de Quebec. http://www.journaldequebec.com/2017...mur#cxrecs_sSorry, it's only available in French. Title would translate to '' RCM hits the wall'' and it mentions the multiplication of releases, in particular those that are totally unrelated to Canada such as superhero/Disney coins It claims that RCM expenses related to marketing went from 217 k in 2010 to 7.6 M in 2015! |
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CCF Master Historian of USA Commemoratives
 United States
12265 Posts |
One of the more interesting quotes from the article:
(rough translation)
Alex Reeves, Senior Communications Manager, says the Crown corporation is reviewing "its numismatic product program."
"Instead of launching new series ... we will now concentrate on our Canada 150 program and our basic numismatic products," he said, referring to the Canadian Federation's anniversary and coins struck to celebrate Canadian identity and collective pride.
Maybe the spigot is finally being tightened vs. opened full bore!
Collecting history one coin or medal at a time! (c) commems. All rights reserved.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
798 Posts |
I think the damage is done. Hopefully they cut back dramatically. Realistically though, they issued a release last year saying that they were going to cut down mintages, but they simply up the mintages of popular releases if they forecast a sell out. Also, there is a company in Liberty village, 4G inc or something, that spins out RCM designs for NCLT. Not sure how long they are contracted to work with the Mint, but they have a staff of 30 people just working on coin designs ... much of it under RCM contract. Edited by JGG
02/10/2017 8:43 pm
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Rest in Peace
United States
233 Posts |
If you eschew Completionism, you only have to collect the ones you like.
Cheers,
/s/ ikeyPikey
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2408 Posts |
Quote:It claims that RCM expenses related to marketing went from 217 k in 2010 to 7.6 M in 2015! X for X program? Edited by canadian_coins
02/12/2017 12:51 am
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Valued Member
Canada
83 Posts |
Hello. New to the "hobby." Very much enjoying thoughtful posts on subjects of interest here. Especially, value vs. price, and what informs our thinking on this relation when we're buying, collecting or taking a pass. If RCM is minting more NCLT than there is stomach for, prices in the secondary should reflect that, eventually. In turn, the corps' 'reviewing its numismatic program' is just what one might expect to happen from such an overproduction. For me, as one who does not want to waste money but is cognizant of the real difficulty of the perfectly timed purchase, be it in the primary or secondary market, the timely questions are not just what to buy, but how much and how long to sit on it. Like many here, it seems, I buy what I like first, and, secondarily, consider its price in some half-imagined future. That future, unfortunately, includes demonetization. As long as NCLT is currency, I see myself as a buyer. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4867 Posts |
I buy coins based on my interest in them, not because of future values or mintages. I think if your buying strictly for future value you are in the wrong hobby. Maybe my sentiment is harsh but that's how I feel.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2845 Posts |
Quote:It claims that RCM expenses related to marketing went from 217 k in 2010 to 7.6 M in 2015! I've casually observed RCM job postings for almost a couple of years now and I've noticed plenty of Directors, analysts, shippers, audit, IT but oddly, no frontline sales positions. What made me curious was the job description of RCM Sales Reps. In all that time, I've noticed not even one. Therefore I'm certain that RCM outsources the services of a Marketing Company who also employs marketing specialists and sales reps to proactively manage RCMs best customers. This type of arrangement is by no means unusual although in some instances it works better than others. For example some businesses outsource customer service and call centres, where employees work for a separate company, sometimes in a different country. That Sales Reps do not work directly for RCM would also be the reason they are unable to resolve RCM service issues. So in my opinion the 7.6 M is most likely paid to a marketing firm contracted by RCM. The intention would be for revenue to be increased, which also has occurred. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3690 Posts |
The article says that advertising expense was $7.6M not sales and marketing. Per the 2015 annual report, marketing and sales expense was $82.6M. Anecdotally, the Mint has vastly stepped up their advertising expenses in the past 6 years. Television ads for the x for x program as well as print media ads and social media (they even advertise on this site and others) didn't exist in 2010 IIRC. No real surprise that the costs associated with advertising have increased significantly. Of S&M expense, salaries and wages were $19.6M. Another $4M went to pensions and termination (reorg) expenses for former S&M personnel. That represents about 20% of total employee compensation expense for the organization. It's highly unlikely that sales reps are outsourced IMO. My former rep lives in Ottawa and left the RCM to take a job with a local tech company. My current rep lives here too and works at 320 Sussex drive. Interestingly, the Mint also had prepaid expenses in 2015 of $2.9M related to special circulation coins that had not yet been approved by Order in Council (note 7). That $2.9M would be expensed in 2016. Keep in mind that $2.9M was spent on marketing circ coins. lol. Goes to show how much they actively market their products and how expensive it is. It's also interesting to note that the authors of the Journal de Quebec article got the advertising expense via an access to information act request. I wonder if anyone has tried requesting information on 2015 annual mintage numbers. As far as I know, the Mint still has yet to published those very important numbers. Edited by CC-Ottawa
02/12/2017 4:05 pm
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21786 Posts |
Do not buy modern collector mint product with the idea of making a profit in selling years later.
Except in just a few rare instances, experience has told me that making a profit will not happen.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2845 Posts |
Quote:
As far as I know, the Mint still has yet to published those very important numbers.
Thanks for your thoughts and clarifications CC. Given the nature of turnover in the field of sales, no job postings for Sales Reps just seems highly unusual. Do you happen to know if the 2017 Charlton Volume Two includes 2015 NCLT sales results? Quote:
Do not buy modern collector mint product with the idea of making a profit in selling years later.
Except in just a few rare instances, experience has told me that making a profit will not happen.  sel_69! This has been the consistent echo of many here. Perhaps someone might share how it is they've been led to believe otherwise. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3690 Posts |
Quote:
2017 Charlton Volume Two includes 2015 NCLT sales results?
I don't but that would be interesting to know. Maybe when it stops snowing (in a day or two) I can get to Chapters and see.  lol. Or maybe someone has a copy. Anyone? |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3690 Posts |
Quote:
Do not buy modern collector mint product with the idea of making a profit in selling years later.
I'd submit that buying and selling old circ coins at a profit is no picnic either. Some on both sides of the coin collection community seem to forget that this is a hobby. Making money from any hobby is more luck than management IMO. |
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CCF Master Historian of USA Commemoratives
United States
12265 Posts |
I think one of the issues behind the lack of published "mintage" figures (sale figures, actually) for 2015 and beyond is the fact that the RCM is still selling 2015-dated coins on its web site. It's hard to publish final sales figutes when you are still selling the coins. This appears to be a policy shift at the RCM. For years, coins were taken off sale after being available for a year. I guess a large inventory of unsold coins has pushed the RCM to change its approach. Collecting history one coin or medal at a time! (c) commems. All rights reserved.
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Posted 02/10/2017 7:20 pm
