fortcollins's Last 20 Posts
| Lincoln 1943 Steal Missing 4 Date
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
 Posted Today 2H 3M ago
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Quote:
Quite possible - after all (If I'm thinking correctly) that on a hub the devices are raised, in order to make the working dies.
A related question is whether there are any 1943 DDOs lurking out there with a broken hub four over an intact four or an intact over broken four. Also, if the four was broken almost completely, what would be visible, especially on a circulated coin?
The 1936 cents are all intact "R" over broken "R" in LIBERTY. The 1941 cents are a mixture of intact/broken, broken/intact, intact/intact, and broken/broken second "T" in TRUST. On the other hand, I'm not aware of any 1956 cent that is confirmed as either broken/intact or intact/broken "6" in the date, although I have paused more than once when looking at 1956-D DDO-005.
There are also the 1943/1942-S and the three major 1949-S DDOs where the 1949 was hubbed over a 194 from 1948, but those are different situations.
Here's another part of the question. The arch inside the four - the opening in the four - would be recessed on a hub. A broken four wouldn't eliminate the arch. Why isn't its outline clear or at least visible on the "ghost four" coins? |
| | Forum: US Modern Variety and Error Coins |
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| Lincoln 1943 Steal Missing 4 Date
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
Posted Yesterday 6:16 pm
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There is a bit of debate about the "ghost 4" coins of 1943. They are extremely common, affecting about a quarter of all of the coins. It's almost always the third digit of the date that is missing and it affects coins from all three mints. If it's grease, why is the third digit affected more than the other digits?
I've heard it suggested, but without any evidence, that there may have been a broken hub four. There are a lot of broken hub coins in this era. The broken hub "R" in LIBERTY in 1936, the broken hub second "T" in trust in 1941, and the broken hub "6" in 1956, to name just three.
Just one more mystery from this era. |
| | Forum: US Modern Variety and Error Coins |
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| Possible 1936 Lincoln Cent DDO FS-103 Example 1
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
Posted Yesterday 2:50 pm
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Don't give up and don't lose heart. Keep looking. They are out there.
I am still going through a huge quantity of wheat cents I purchased from three separate estates a couple years ago. I've looked through over 3,000 1936 cents to date. I have found 8 of the DDO-003, 3 of the DDO-002, and none of the DDO-001 (that one is truly rare). The minor doubled dies and most of the doubled die reverses are fairly common. I will say that on heavily circulated coins (AG/G), DDO-003 is more subtle, because the lettering wears down enough to make the doubling difficult to spot. Even then, the letters will be much thicker than usual.
If you have the chance, gather a good number of 1936 cents and spend time looking at each die pairing. You will start to see the issues the mint had during that year, with overworked dies, extensive die clash polishing, metal alloy issues, and strike quality. You will also start identifying die pairings that you see frequently, recognizable by their die polishing and die markers that will start to look familiar after a while. Take the time to look for the minor DDOs and DDRs. Over time, this experience will help you sort through the coins more quickly. You will start to give nicknames to the die pairings that you see frequently.
Again, welcome here. Keep posting, hang out on the boards, and keep learning. We are all learners together on here. |
| | Forum: US Modern Variety and Error Coins |
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| Possible 1936 Lincoln Cent DDO FS-103 Example 1
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
Posted Yesterday 10:42 am
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On the 1936 FS-103 / DD0-003 / 1-DO-003 / WDDO-003 the key pickup point is the broken "R" in LIBERTY. The "R" is broken all the way to where the left leg of the "R" connects to the loop of the "R." For comparison, here are the "R" in LIBERTY on two of the DDO-003's I found. You will see the difference between these and your coins.
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| | Forum: US Modern Variety and Error Coins |
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| Possible 1936 Lincoln Cent DDO FS-103 Example 1
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
Posted Yesterday 10:26 am
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| Thanks for posting the additional photos. This is definitely not DDO-003. It has the intact "R" in LIBERTY. I wanted the complete photos because the die polishing in the original photos made me think it might match what I saw on a minor 1936 DDR that I keep finding. It isn't that one, either. Just a normal 1936 cent. |
| | Forum: US Modern Variety and Error Coins |
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| Possible 1936 Lincoln Cent DDO FS-103 Example 2
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
Posted Yesterday 10:07 am
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Your coin is not DDO-003. The doubling on all three of the major DDOs for 1936 is significant, even in later die stages.
I wanted to see the whole-coin photos for this one because there are several minor DDOs for 1936, and I saw something that made me think of one of them. Check Lincoln's eyelid to see if there is minor doubling, and compare your coin to DDO-009. There are several markers for that variety listed on each of the big three web sites, including the die polishing lines in the eye and lathe lines through the "L" of LIBERTY. DDO-009 is quite common. |
| | Forum: US Modern Variety and Error Coins |
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| 1938-D Buffalo Nickel For Grading
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
Posted Yesterday 09:45 am
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Nice coin!
Like your others, this one has a typical strike and typical bag marks. The obverse die has had more die clash polishing than the reverse die, most notable on the Indian's face and eye. (That's the buffalo's right rear leg / LIBERTY clash polishing.) The vast majority of slabbed 1938-D Buffs are MS-66, but in the wild, the vast majority are MS-64 or MS-65. Except for bulk submissions, it isn't worth sending in any 1938-D that can't make MS-68. Your coin has several small nicks on the Indian's cheek and neck. The reverse, however, has more contact marks on the buffalo's left shoulder, flank, and upper back. IMHO, this coin likely is MS-64, and just short of MS-65 to a TPG. On a bourse floor, it would pass for MS-65.
Take a close look at the mint mark. This looks like a 1938-D/D, and my best suggestion for a starting point is 1938-D RPM-009 on Variety Vista, which is also WRPM-009 on Wexler. There are two diagnostic die scratches listed on Wexler's site, and I think I see them on your coin, but it's much better if you can verify it in hand. Look at both sites, because some of the RPMs are listed on one site, but not the other. |
| | Forum: US Classic and Colonial Coin Grading |
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| Possible 1936 Lincoln Cent DDO FS-103 Example 3
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
Posted 05/18/2025 8:23 pm
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First, 
This coin is not DDO-003. This coin has an intact "R" in LIBERTY, rather than an intact "R" hubbed over a broken hub "R." ON DDO-001, the date and all lettering are sharply doubled, and the "R" in LIBERTY is sharply doubled to the right. On DDO-002 and DDO-003, the left leg of the "R" distinctly looks like a pirate with a "peg leg." On all three, the motto is sharply doubled. |
| | Forum: US Modern Variety and Error Coins |
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| General Question About Oddity On Buffalos
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
Posted 05/16/2025 11:54 am
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It is especially common on the Denver and San Francisco coins, because the branch mints badly overworked their dies to meet production levels. Philadelphia made the dies for all the mints, and had the advantage of being able to make additional dies on site as they needed them. |
| | Forum: US Classic and Colonial Coins |
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| 1919-S Buffalo - Two Feather?
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
Posted 05/16/2025 08:16 am
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There are two different 1919-S obverse dies that have been considered as 2F. On one die, a shadow of the third feather exists into late die stage. On the second die, repeated polishing eliminated all but a lump near the top of the right side of the third feather. Neither 1919-S has the entire third feather missing.
Your coin appears to be the first die, with the shadow remaining. From the die gouges, your coin seems to have been struck fairly early after a die polishing, but not the first die polishing.
Ron Pope listed both as 2F coins, but considered the second die to be "more" of a true 2F, if that makes sense.
Short answer is that it met Ron's criteria for a 2F.
You have a nice specimen, both higher grade and a fairly early die state of the variety. That date and mint in general has a lot of coins from badly overworked dies. |
| | Forum: US Classic and Colonial Coins |
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| Lincoln Cents - Styles Of Numbers In Dates
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
Posted 05/16/2025 07:26 am
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In the 1940s, all eleven of the fours in the dates are different, including the second four in 1944. This makes it possible to identify the date of any 1940s Lincoln Cent entirely by the third digit. This is important when distinguishing coins - usually 1942, 1947, or 1948 - with the fourth digit altered to pass as 1943 bronze cents. It also is how the three major 1949-S DDOs were identified as 1949 over 194 from 1948.
In looking at the ten different fours used as the third digit of the year, what varies from date to date are:
 North-South positioning of the top of the 4 relative to the 9. The fours can be above the 9, level with the 9, slightly below the 9, or far below the 9.
East-West distance of the 4 from the 9. The fours can be close, average or distant.
Whether the four is tall or squat. Sometimes this is worded as whether the arch (the open area inside the 4) is tall or squat.
Once those have been determined, the points of the four pin down the date. Working counterclockwise from the top:
Whether the top of the 4 is pointed, blunt, or flared
Whether the left point of the 4 is pointed or blunt
Whether the bottom crosslet end - the foot - is long or short. All are squared, so the length is the only issue.
Whether the right crosslet end - the arm - is long or short and whether it is squared, angled, or flared.
One complication with this is that the third digit of the date frequently is weak or missing on 1943 cents. |
| | Forum: US Modern Coins |
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| 1906 P Liberty Head Nickel (V Nickel) For Grading
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fortcollins
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United States
3059 Posts |
Posted 05/14/2025 6:35 pm
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I played with your photo a bit. Here's the result:
There is just barely a complete rim, and stars 11 and 13 are just separate from it. I think this one makes G-04 by the skin of its teeth.
The reverse is stronger on your coin, and EPU is mostly readable. That isn't always true for G-04 coins. Sometimes it's missing completely.
IMHO, that makes it a good example for a grading set. What helps the most in a grading set is to find the weakest coin you can find that barely makes each grade. For lower grade Liberty Nickels in particular, having the bottom coins you can find for FR-02, AG-03, G-04, G-06, VG-08, VG-10, and F-12 is worth the time and effort. Weakest-possible example coins for FR-02 through G-06 are readily available in dealer junk boxes, with a little effort. VG-08, VG-10, and F-12 may require searching through 2x2 boxes and albums. You probably won't need a PO-01 or F-15 or higher, since everything below your FR-02 has to be a PO-01 and the F-15 and higher coins have much easier identifying traits.
That's part of the trouble with online grading photos. The sites tend to pick a good example of each grade, but that isn't what people need when looking at coins in the wild. Having the lowest possible coin for each grade is much more helpful.
Just some thoughts.
Good example coin! |
| | Forum: US Classic and Colonial Coin Grading |
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| 1906 P Liberty Head Nickel (V Nickel) For Grading
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
Posted 05/14/2025 3:38 pm
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Liberty nickels are struck in such low relief that preservation of the design elements depends heavily on the strength of the rim. When the rim breaks down, the rest of the design elements go quickly.
To me, the wholeness of the obverse rim and separation of the reverse letters from the rim are key distinctions between AG-03 and G-04. I look for three things:
Can the entire obverse rim be seen at all? In other words, even if it is minimal, is it complete? Are all 13 of the obverse stars separate from the rim, even minimally?
For Liberty's design, is her ear hole distinct enough to tell that it is an ear? Is there any distinction between the curl on her cap and the leaves, or does it look like she's sitting there with a turtle on her head?
On the reverse, are the letters separate from the rim, even if the rim itself isn't complete?
On your coin, I can't quite see the area of stars 9-13 and the rim closest to them to tell if it is visible, but that is where I would focus. The rest of the coin looks like it would make G-04. |
| | Forum: US Classic and Colonial Coin Grading |
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| Carbon Spots Inside Mint Unc Coin Rolls
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fortcollins
Pillar of the Community
United States
3059 Posts |
Posted 05/13/2025 4:12 pm
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For the last 20-ish years, the Denver Mint has bagged cents in ballistic coin bags that are filled by weight, and have around 400,000 cents in each bag. The ballistic bags are designed to protect the coins, but nothing that happens after the bags are opened protect the coins.
These bags are transported to Federal Reserve Banks, and sold to armored car companies. Loomis and Garda are two of the largest armored carriers, but there are hundreds of them nationally. The armored carriers roll the coins and sell them to banks in 50-roll boxes. Your coin rolls likely have the name of the armored carrier that rolled the coins.
Once the armored carrier buys the coins and opens the ballistic bags, all bets are off. Remember, these are mass produced metal objects intended to be used in circulation, and aren't treated as numismatic value items. They can be exposed to almost anything - water, humidity, dirt, etc. - while being processed, rolled, boxed, transported, stored in bank vaults, or after sale to business customers or bank customers.
Many years ago, the Denver Mint had a walk-up window where ordinary people could buy bags of coins. As a kid, I helped my dad by carrying the bags of coins he bought for our family hardware store. We did it as an advertising gimmick, trying to be one of the first places in town to have the new year's coins. We may have been the first Denver business to get the Kennedy Half dollars in 1964. We beat the banks by a couple days. The walk-up window disappeared long ago. |
| | Forum: Main Coin Forum |
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