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My First Ancient, Impulse Buy, Julian II 360-363 Ae3 Nummus

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Pillar of the Community
Italy
1790 Posts
 Posted 02/24/2015  6:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Augustus Maximus to your friends list
Sounds like you are looking for some Severan Denarii and some Antonininanii.
PM sent.
Edited by Augustus Maximus
02/24/2015 6:20 pm
Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
3626 Posts
 Posted 02/24/2015  6:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add pishpash to your friends list
There are Viking coins, you definitely need to get them from a dealer to guarantee authenticity. A lot of the denarii became more and more debased, there is a lot written on it if you search the web.
Pillar of the Community
United States
5155 Posts
 Posted 02/24/2015  8:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ancientnoob to your friends list
Well compared to the other guys, I would be inclined to grab up the coin for $72. The coin granted is common, but these 4th century bronze are scarce and sought after in high grades. The fact that its slabbed MS makes it worth more than it ever will be out of the slab. Honest I'm not a huge fan of slabs, I have freed coins and I have encapsulated coins (all ancient). I would certainly buy this coin and if I were you I would try my darndest to equal that coin on your next purchase and people will tip their hats to your ancient collection.
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United States
23731 Posts
 Posted 02/24/2015  9:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list
Well after checking sales on Vcoins, it appears that the price of this coin type in similar condition is a lot higher than in the past. So it would seem that what you paid is actually not a bad price.
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United States
4971 Posts
 Posted 02/24/2015  10:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chrsmat71 to your friends list
yeah, I would say for the condition, that price isn't really unreasoanble.
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United States
513 Posts
 Posted 02/25/2015  3:56 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chuy1530 to your friends list
Good news and more good news. The price for that particular coin is just about right, and other coins during that time period of similar quality are often cheaper so if the bug bites you can actually build up a respectable collection with not a ton of money.

If you're looking for well struck silver coins Gordian III, Philip I, Severus and Postumus are the ones I've noticed the best price:quality ratio on, in that order. There may be others during that time period as well. Generally the earlier you go in Roman history the more expensive the coins get, the major exception being that late Roman silver coins (I think the jump is after Gallienus but there might be some after him) are very expensive. You can find big nice looking silvered bronze coins of the Tetrarchy (especially Diocletian) which would tie into your theme nicely though.
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United Kingdom
4208 Posts
 Posted 02/25/2015  4:13 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ben to your friends list
You can get these much cheaper but this requires vigilance, patience (by the bucketload) and confidence in authenticity - and you'll have no slab with it. An excellent way to get one of these really cheap is to buy it uncleaned - the major investment there is time.

All ancients are for handling, with few exceptions (crystallised siliquae, mint state gold, museum grade rarities etc), so I recommend you pick up a few 'loose' coins. A good chunky 3rd century ant can be had for £20 on a bad day (my record is under £5 for a lot which included a Gordian III ant) and they can be handled to your hearts content. If you see something you like, post a picture here and we'll be able to tell you its authenticity.
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United States
513 Posts
 Posted 02/25/2015  4:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chuy1530 to your friends list
You can get some nice finds in uncleaned lots, but unless you have a good source you will end up with picked over lots and more coins with the only legible part of the legend being 'CONST' than you can shake a stick at. I've found a couple Julian IIs but not in this condition.

Patience is key though when buying, and flexibility. If you just want any Crisis era ant. then you'll probably be able to find a good deal pretty quickly. If you want one ruler, or one type, it's just going to take that much longer.
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Australia
16849 Posts
 Posted 02/25/2015  8:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list

Quote:
Ardent believer that the longest hair on a man's body should always be on his chin.

You can learn a lot about the coming and going of facial hair fashion in the Roman period via the coinage.

Early Roman emperors are beardless; the early Romans copied the ancient Greeks after they conquered Greek territory. The first bearded emperor was Hadrian, who apparently had a skin condition that meant he preferred not to shave. Of course, once the emperor went around bearded, everyone else did too, and the beard soon became a badge of office of the emperor. There are even examples of people who became emperor while still very young, whose coins show a beard even though they were physically too young to grow one. Beards did not disappear from the coinage until the time of Constantine.

An exception to the "nobody wore beards" in Greek culture were the philosophers; a beard was in effect part of their uniform. Emperor Marcus Aurelius fancied himself a philosopher in the Stoic tradition, so you find him with a long, philosopher's beard on his coins.

Julian II also fancied himself as a philosopher so, as part of his "pagan revival", wore a very prominent bead on his coinage.

Quote:
A common theme of my collection is the debasement of money... I think I would like to do the history of the Roman civilization and their debasement of silver coinage and the decline of the empire / republic / etc.

You might find this graph I drew up some time ago to be of interest. It show the typical fineness of the Roman denarius/antoninianus over time:

My-First-Ancient,-Impulse-Buy,-Julian-II-360-363-Ae3-Nummus


Quote:
I think it would be an interesting display to have 30 of the pieces of silver of the type Judas received.

We don't really know what kind of coins Judas was likely to have received, or even if they were thirty actual coins or an amount of money that weighed thirty shekels. The coins usually sold as "Judas coins" are the Shekels of Tyre, as it is known that the Jewish Temple authorities preferred payment in these, rather than the more debased Roman coinage.

Needless to say, any coin that can be marketed as a "Biblical coin" can command a hefty premium over a coin that is equally old and scarce that didn't get a mention in the Bible. If you want 30 of them, be prepared to pay thousands of dollars.

Quote:
I would really like a Viking coin if there is such a thing too.

The Vikings mainly stole and used other people's silver - Viking silver hoards contain anything and everything, including Islamic silver dirhams all the way from North Africa. But they did make a few very scarce coin types in Denmark and Norway itself, many of which depict their famous longships. Ironically, we had someone post one just recently.

Of course, "Viking" is a broad term. You can include coins the Viking colonists in Ireland and England issued, which are cheaper and more readily available then the Scandinavian types.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
Pillar of the Community
United States
711 Posts
 Posted 02/25/2015  11:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BuckeyeCoinGuy to your friends list
All great help. Much appreciated.

So it sounds like the 30 pieces of silver isn't going to happen.

The silver % chart will help. I will likely end up picking up a few examples showing the decline. Probably going to stay with buying slabbed and nice shape for a little while still. Don't have a local source so I need to use the internet to pick up anything. The slabs make me more confident in purchasing.


Great info on the history of beards.


I kind of like the idea of my own Viking hoard / type set. Coins from the Viking Era that they could have raided for.
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United Kingdom
3626 Posts
 Posted 02/26/2015  06:00 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add pishpash to your friends list
Just because something is slabbed doesn't mean that it is authentic. On ebay they have slabbed very poor quality coins that are worth about 50p each. Checkout the labels on the slabs to make sure they come from a quality company. Good luck, looking forward to your next coin.
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Russian Federation
5177 Posts
 Posted 02/28/2015  3:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add january1may to your friends list

Quote:
A common theme of my collection is the debasement of money. I like the US melt story and can do it in a type set display. Same thing with Canada for the most part. Not a full type set, but lots of examples. Same thing with Mexico, England, France, Germany, and some others. I kind of pick up stuff that is interesting and in budget.

I really like my big aluminum 5 Franc coin. I am a materials science guy and density of PVC formulas pays my bills. The low density metal in a big coin is just a show stopper to me. Probably not worth the $2 - $3 I paid for it either, but it certainly was to me.


Do you have an aluminium 2 pengo coin from Hungary?
The history of the Hungarian pengo ends with one of the most major cases of hyperinflation; the sheer inflation had not been equalled until the Yugoslav dinars, and the exchange rate for a single redenomination (at least 21 zeros dropped - it's a little complicated, and some give an even larger figure) remains a record to this day.
Debasement in a literal sense does apply as well - the pengo used to be silver in the 1920s (I have a 1 pengo coin from that period), but in the early 1940s, aluminium issues were made (they're actually quite beautiful coins... unlike the French 5 franc IMHO).
There's apparently an even larger aluminium 5 pengo coin around; I should get one some day.

Another very famous - and slightly less modern than the 1940s, though not quite all the way up to this forum - example of debasement is the so-called Copper Riot coinage from mid-17th century Russia. Of course, as I kind of live in the same country, for me it is very common to find these coins, and I've bought some examples for less than $0.25 each; they might be a lot harder to find elsewhere (especially since most of them aren't particularly good quality).
Pillar of the Community
United States
711 Posts
 Posted 03/03/2015  4:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BuckeyeCoinGuy to your friends list
Thanks for the tip on the Hungarian Pengo. 21 digits being dropped in a revaluation is crazy.


As for the ancient I bought in this thread, I finally received it in hand. Great looking coin in hand. Probably going to buy a silver denarius next, no hurries though.
Pillar of the Community
United States
5155 Posts
 Posted 03/03/2015  5:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ancientnoob to your friends list
That's awsome you got your coin and now you want a silver denarius. You are definitely showing signs of the early stages of AC addiction. My advice save your money and put the needle in your arm...and get a Greek Tetradrachm, I doubt you will ever be same.


Alexander The Great Lifetime Tetradrachm c. BC 325.

My-First-Ancient,-Impulse-Buy,-Julian-II-360-363-Ae3-Nummus
Pillar of the Community
United States
5155 Posts
 Posted 03/03/2015  5:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ancientnoob to your friends list
If your one of those guys who only collects "Romans" then one of these will seal the deal for you as well.

Roman Republic
First Meris, Amphipolis Macedon 1st district of Macedonia.

My-First-Ancient,-Impulse-Buy,-Julian-II-360-363-Ae3-Nummus
Edited by Ancientnoob
03/03/2015 5:13 pm
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