Fake Greek And Roman Silver Coins On Ebay

Travelcoin:

If you do that or not it won't matter. People are biased against ebay and that will never change. If it was not the case there would be lists of vcoin dealers who gave people a hard time. So the list of trusted ebay sellers implies most can't be trusted. There is nothing the company can do or say to make a difference. I just opened up a Heritage auction lot, so the coins in the photo, we will know the real going price because of ebay and an open auction. That helps everyone and keeps people from hyping up coins they list many times over what they paid.

Jskiwin;

I do understand really. But when you say, "As a general rule I believe new collectors should avoid ebay," that is a blatant bias sadly based in very little. You don't mention the hoops top rated sellers go through including having to stand in line at the post office every day just to make the 24 hours or less shipping and acknowledgement by the government post office. You don't mention the fact we have to return money for any reason and buyers are protected in the 30 day window if they dislike coins for any reason. I am quite sure I follow stricter rules than any vcoins dealer but that is besides the point. You just tell new buyers to avoid ebay and let some vcoins dealer price a coin 3 times what they paid for it? I'll never understand the bias but accept it is part of American society I suppose. All I know is I just put up a Nero, Caligula, and some republic denarius coins tonight and they start at $1 with rust on the flip staple from the old Heritage collector. And I know for sure the correct market value of these coins will be achieved and not a dollar more. Plus I bring in people who first ask why ancient coins are so cheap and end up in a year buying vcoins as real collectors. So I find the rare gene that likes ancients from the public simply searching for a book on Rome and end up exploring ancients. The value we at ebay bring to this collectors system is important.

Travelcoin;

In response to: "Louisville, you have to admit, the sheer amount of fakes that are being sold on ebay have unfortunately given them a bad name. No doubt about that."

Like others I filled out the USA homeland forms to be an importer of record with shipping companies. Paypal reports my earnings and I am registered as a company, I pay a lot of federal, state, and city taxes that goes to keeping the country running and school systems. Not to mention the huge amount of money I generate for the postal system that surely needs us now that regular Americans do online banking and don't mail with stamps.

I say this because the platform I choose to house my business continually paints my business on these boards in a negative light. Only by speaking up can anyone even start to admit there are decent companies that use the ebay platform. So you must admit if people constantly trashed vcoins for various reasons people would be upset. If people listed vcoins dealers on websites that overcharge for coins they clearly paid very little for and ignored ebay dealers who did that people would be upset. So I would hope everyone would understand that constantly trashing my platform, which as I stated in previous posts does so much good for the ancient coin business in finding new people who never would have dreamed such a hobby exists is just completely unfortunate. Just because it is not a racial bias it does not mean it isn't wrong to stereotype a whole class of vendors. Just think about if you said someone had to admit most people from a certain race or class are a certain way? Even if that had a legitimate basis in your experience you think you would be accepted making such a statement in this day and age? (Yes we are all overly sensitive to any profiling I know and this year has been extreme.) The bottom line as as good intentioned folks are about telling people to stay away from ebay and shop with others you only hurt valid business owners bottom line and depress sales. You would not tolerate that if people blacklisted other platforms you support.

@louisvillekyshop
I've been collecting ancients for 5+ years. Before that I did sportscards, and ebay has played an important role in the collecting community. It has been a boon to collectors everywhere, filling niches that few knew existed.
But I stand by my general rule of avoiding ebay for new collectors although I am willing to qualify it to exclude for honest sellers such as yourself.
I like TC's idea of a trusted ebay sellers list. That would be as useful as the NFSL.

I'm on the market for a particular coin at the moment and went to ebay where I found several fakes being sold by sellers on the Forum's NFSL. They are commanding top dollar - we're talking suspected coins selling for hundreds of dollars. In the past I've reported such instances, but it's spitting in the wind. Any new collector who hadn't found this forum (or similar ones) would be ripe for the picking. While Vcoins isn't perfect, ebay has never figured out a way of keeping counterfeits and fakes off its site. They have been the bane of the site since its foundation in the late 90s.

When I was new to the hobby I was told "Know the coin or know the seller." It is a principle that every newbie should take to heart. In your case they could trust you if you were on a list of reputable ebay sellers. I'd be happy to assist building it.

Indeed!
While I am not a buyer of ancients on ebay or anywhere else, I think this decision process applies to many categories.

Starting from the principle of caveat emptor, and my (in)experience level, I buy 95+% of my coins from auction houses who I am sure will stand behind any questionable purchase for as long as they are in business. The coins I have bought for my collection on ebay I can count on the fingers of my two hands, and I am 90% confident they are authentic.

I realize this means I pay more per coin than someone who is willing to take more risk about fakes.

But I never lose a minute of sleep worrying about authenticity.

It's just a personal choice.

Here is an "answer" to why ebay does not police fake sellers like VCOINS when someone writes in to tell them. Or it is very hard to get them to sanction someone unless it is an over the top violator etc. Just my opinion below:

I understand and respect this opinion about being wary of ebay for ancients more and more as the years go by and indeed it is the number one opinion of ebay by anyone into buying ancients. It also explains the allegiance to VCOINS by so many members of the community. And why often I am not at all understood as someone who supports ebay so frequently on these posts. VCOINS can police itself as it is like a ferry that has an unruly passenger when there is someone who disrespects others. It is a created entity entirely for the promotion and sale of ancients and the unruly passenger can seriously hurt the business. ebay is much different. More like the United States of America with all that comes along with running it and some people cheat on their taxes and you get upset with the USA. Moving the United States is like moving a giant ocean liner and is quite hard to make react to any incident. ebay does not police each category except for a blanket one size fits all set of rules that governs selling used clothes to expensive cars. Moves are heavy handed and huge affecting the lady selling diapers as much as coins the same. But the price of the ticket to get the eyes so my model of $1 start can work, only ebay can do that. My model fails completely on VCOINS as I would sell without competition from non coin people etc. And I desperately want my model to succeed to see these coins find correct market values for literature of reference based on supply and demand, even if that literature is past ebay sales that started at $1. (And of course to be successful for monetary reasons as any businessman.) ebay would have to hire experts to have Czar like powers to pull auctions of people selling fake ancients and that cost both money and litigation. Plus even NGC can't guarantee so one wrong pull and the deep pockets for the lawsuit would be ebay.

So I guess I am saying I understand everyone more these days. And I also hope ebay can start to police reports of fake coin sellers better, without messing up the lady selling cat holiday pot holders in the process. :-)

Pertinax:

You make a good point. A person can find out even 10 years later the coin was not real and get their money back, as you did with a London dealer. Now VCOINS has the following Pledge before someone can sell a coin:

"I will vouch for the authenticity of items I sell and will have no time limit on the return of items discovered to be non-authentic. I will offer a full cash refund upon return of any such item, including the cost of return shipping."

My question is: If a VCOINS dealer passes on or closes a store and can't be found, who exactly do you get your money back from 10 years later when you find out the coin is not real? Thus the only issue is would I give a pledge that if you can prove the coin is not real will I accept it back? My store has been around since 2003, and no one has ever asked so sure, I'll write that on my listings starting today, but I will say for as long as I am of sound mind running the store. Lifetime guarantee implies the lifetime of the buyer and I don't think VCOINS will force the widow to accept coins or children of the estate after the dealer passes.

Pertinax;

Here is a photo of coins I'll never sell in the black box I pulled over the years. When you buy estates to resell you buy the collectors mistakes, some more obvious than others. But you can't just not buy estates if there is 1 in 200 you suspect, you just have to do your job and pull them from the collecting circulation and label the black box correctly so when they find it after you die they know not to sell these. Great examples for coin talks of course.