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Help With A Sassanian, Gadhaiya Silver Coin ?

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5806 Posts
 Posted 12/28/2018  5:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Very nice! Must have been under an unusual listing title to slip under my radar

That is at the very end of series 1.2 - I like to call it the Neanderthal Portrait type, for obvious reasons. This is the type that bridges the gap to the curved head type, you can see the attendants' bodies now run in parallel with the arm, and the reverse is almost back to fitting on the coin.

I actually picked up a really fun example, albeit for a lot more than $3!


My Collections:
Roman Imperial
http://goccf.com/t/348979
Japan Type set Tokugawa + Modern
http://goccf.com/t/348999
Indo Sassanian
http://goccf.com/t/322087
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Spain
1732 Posts
 Posted 12/29/2018  10:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Palouche to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks Steve!

Quote:
Must have been under an unusual listing title to slip under my radar
..To make you feel better it was $8 not $3 sorry!

It certainly was! I stumbled upon it whilst looking for something completely different....

Thats a nice coin you've got there, love the protruding forehead and brow!

What are your thoughts on the shape of the head? Its seems almost like the portrait is wearing some sort of headware especially on your coin?

Paul
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Spain
1732 Posts
 Posted 12/31/2018  04:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Palouche to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Just picked up these two...Good silver content...

Ok lets see if I've learnt anything here! Both coins are from Finns series 4.
Top coin.....Series 4 / Sub-type 3 Intermediate style?
Bottom coin..Series 4 / Sub-type 4 Degenerate?

Fingers crossed!
Edited by Palouche
12/31/2018 04:29 am
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 Posted 01/02/2019  3:26 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Nice pick-ups! He has had some amazing offerings lately, and I've picked up a lot more than I probably should have!

Attributions are correct - I am mulling over how to break down series 4; whether 4 sub-types are enough or if I should further break it out into 5. He has had a few super-degenerate types lately - any luck snagging any of those?
My Collections:
Roman Imperial
http://goccf.com/t/348979
Japan Type set Tokugawa + Modern
http://goccf.com/t/348999
Indo Sassanian
http://goccf.com/t/322087
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Spain
1732 Posts
 Posted 02/02/2019  12:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Palouche to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
He has had a few super-degenerate types lately - any luck snagging any of those?

Just picked this one up...looks like Finns Series 5 - Vaghela Type http://goccf.com/t/276704&whichpage=4
15mm diameter/4.49 grams..Low silver content
Edited by Palouche
02/02/2019 1:44 pm
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 Posted 02/03/2019  3:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Nice one! It is indeed 1.5, probably minted by the Vaghelas. There have been a lot of very nice specimens up on ebay in the past few months - much less corroded than normally seen.
My Collections:
Roman Imperial
http://goccf.com/t/348979
Japan Type set Tokugawa + Modern
http://goccf.com/t/348999
Indo Sassanian
http://goccf.com/t/322087
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Netherlands
145 Posts
 Posted 02/04/2019  10:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MetzKaj to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Absuletely in love with these coins. Yours are breathtaking. I only have 4..



Also, an ID would be very welcome. :D
Edited by MetzKaj
02/04/2019 10:13 pm
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Spain
1732 Posts
 Posted 02/05/2019  04:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Palouche to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi MetzKaj....I too fell in love with these style coins...But I'm just a beginner...Finn235 is the expert on this series and ran an amazing informative research thread you might like to look at..http://goccf.com/t/276704
Nice set of coins there..I think they're these types but hopefully Steve will be along to clarify...Paul
First 3 coins...Series 4....Sub-type 1 - Orthodox style; Large head
Last coin.......Series 4....Sub-type 3 - Intermediate style
Edited by Palouche
02/05/2019 04:34 am
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Netherlands
145 Posts
 Posted 02/05/2019  06:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MetzKaj to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Awesome!
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 Posted 02/05/2019  9:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Glad to see the Gadhaiya Paisa getting some love! You have the start of a nice collection :)

I am considering taking my series 4 back to the drawing board - I still maintain that there was a series of "orthodox" coins being made extremely well and to tight standards, but I'm less convinced now that there were two distinct types. Likewise, the exact boundary between the curved head and regular gadhaiya is a lot less clear now.

I promise I'm working on it!
My Collections:
Roman Imperial
http://goccf.com/t/348979
Japan Type set Tokugawa + Modern
http://goccf.com/t/348999
Indo Sassanian
http://goccf.com/t/322087
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Spain
1732 Posts
 Posted 01/25/2020  5:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Palouche to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Recent pick up the 'dumbell nose' type.

This is in nice condition with what seems to be a good silver content..14mm/4.05gr

I'm assuming this is from Finns series 1.6.3 with no face.

Steve just how rare are these?

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 Posted 01/25/2020  5:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bob L to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Nice one, Paul.
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 Posted 01/26/2020  1:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Nice pick up! I won several from the same seller as well.

These types are hard to assess, although I would agree that I believe they are rare. Maheshwari didn't document a single one of them, although I think all of his ~200 odd coins were from a single hoard.

I think that maybe 4-5 small groups of these have come up for sale in the past decade?

Searching online, I found a handful in a virtual collection site that listed upload dates of about 2012. I think that ACSB bought into the hoard, and still have some for sale. That hoard is likely also where you and I bought a few coins from this series back in early 2017. The seller that I bought the 1.11 circle lips coins from also had a couple of these, and I have seen them for sale from the usual suspects out of India at least on two separate occasions since 2016. I'd estimate maybe 75-150 specimens floating around in collections currently?
My Collections:
Roman Imperial
http://goccf.com/t/348979
Japan Type set Tokugawa + Modern
http://goccf.com/t/348999
Indo Sassanian
http://goccf.com/t/322087
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
Spain
1732 Posts
 Posted 01/27/2020  04:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Palouche to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks Steve.....
I do like the simplicity of these more abstract later types..
Rarer but probably easier to categorize?..Interesting why Maheshwari didn't document this type....
Any ideas as to why the silver content dramatically dropped between your 1.6.3 and 1.6.4 series..?
Paul
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United States
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 Posted 01/27/2020  2:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It's an interesting conundrum - someone sent me a link to a recent presentation that John Deyell did on the composition of these pieces - it is publicly available on the Facebook page for the Oriental Numismatic Society of North America. The gist of Deyell's findings is that nearly all Indo Sassanian coins are surface-enriched; some of his coins that tested as ~80% fine on the surface via XRF testing were only ~20% fine in the core. I suspect that even these coins in bright flashy silver could just be like the bright flashy antoninianii of the late 3rd century Rome - just hiding a core of low grade billon, albeit with a thicker outer layer. I still need to image all of my examples of this type, but I did recently nab a couple that bridge the composition gap, although not the stylistic one...


First is stylistically a regular 1.6.4, but appears to be in "good" silver

Note the highly stylized ear, simplified fire altar, and the addition of dots in the middle of the lines of the altar bowl and base

And this one stylistically ought to be at the tail end of the series, but this one is a dull grey but visibly more than 2% silver.

Here the ear is replaced with a short Nagari phrase - Maheshwari reads "Srila" - "(He who) has Sri (majesty/splendor)"
My Collections:
Roman Imperial
http://goccf.com/t/348979
Japan Type set Tokugawa + Modern
http://goccf.com/t/348999
Indo Sassanian
http://goccf.com/t/322087
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