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2011 Ladybug coin massive devaluation the RCNA auction today  
 

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Pillar of the Community

Canada
3990 Posts
 Posted 08/09/2018  10:01 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Today's RCNA auction two Ladybug coins sold for 560 and a graded 70 went for 590.00 juice included, if this isn't a sign for the NCLT market for the future, no matter any coin in time will decrease in value. Simply there just too many issues and not enough new collectors.
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United States
2187 Posts
 Posted 08/09/2018  10:58 pm  Show Profile   Check canadian_coins's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add canadian_coins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Not to mention poor quality.
A picture is worth a thousand words.
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Canada
520 Posts
 Posted 08/10/2018  12:47 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Optimist-numismatist to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I feel bad for those who get tricked into buying these as investments.
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Canada
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 Posted 08/10/2018  01:16 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MoneyPenney to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There is no doubt the NCLT market is in serious decline. A couple of days I posted the sale of the 2015 Moon Mask set which sold for little over 50% of original issue price.

Other coins in the CA auction did not fare very well either.

Like this one: http://www.icollector.com/2012-2013...-2_i30772282, issue $360 sold $142.

or this one:

http://www.icollector.com/Estate-Lo...As_i30772701, issue $440 sold $147.
Edited by MoneyPenney
08/10/2018 01:20 am
Valued Member
Canada
444 Posts
 Posted 08/10/2018  10:36 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chadcoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If I recall issue price was $140.00
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 Posted 08/10/2018  11:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add commems to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think there are several factors driving the decline of modern NCLT:

1) There has been a rise in the number of modern coin collectors who focus on bullion issues. The coins are generally less expensive, an ever-increasing variety of issues is available and often are offered in multi-year series that many collectors enjoy. This change in collecting preference has pulled many NCLT collectors away and/or kept many from even starting NCLT collecting.

2) Many world mints, including the RCM, are using a “shotgun” approach to their new issues, releasing a dizzying array of coins with an increasing number of gimmicks in an attempt to lure collectors. They would be better off trying to create a few meaningful series that have a limited number of issues each year but that have the potential to keep collectors engaged for many years. Many collectors still enjoy assembling sets of coins over time.

3) Most modern NCLT issues are overpriced at the time of their release. World mints have spent lots of money researching price points for their new coins and generally price their coins at or near the maximum the market will bear. As a result, there is very little room for a collector to realize any value appreciation. Yes, some releases are “hot” for a short time and see an increase in their market value, but I would generally characterize these as “mistakes” by the issuing mint (i.e., they misread the market).

4) Pop culture themes have been heavily used (i.e., over-used) by NCLT issuers over the past five+ years. Almost by definition, individual pop culture icons are a short-term phenomenon. Once a given pop culture topic/theme runs its course, the vast majority of those who were interested in it move on to the next “hot” thing. No more clear example of this can be seen with almost of the pop culture themed coins. They are “yesterday’s news” and few want them!

5) Too many “collectors” got involved in modern NCLT because they believed there was quick money to be made in reselling coins. Once many of these folks realized that easy money was not guaranteed, they left the hobby and pursued other possibilities.

Most coin collectors begin as accumulators. Their initial excitement leads them to start off buying lots of different coins, tokens, notes, etc. Eventually most find what holds special interest for them and then they begin to focus on more specific aspects of the hobby. This transition is what converts folks into long-term collectors – a focused approach to their pursuits. From reading posts here in the Canadian NCLT area for more than six years, it seems a good number of folks enjoyed accumulating lots of new releases but didn't always take the time to plan out their long-term goals for their involvement in the hobby. This has led to many contributors here on CCF coming and going as their interest waned.

As I’ve said here before, my core collections are comprised of “classic” coins and medals, but I also enjoy collecting some modern pieces as well. I do my best, however, to maintain a focus for my NCLT purchases so that I can limit the money I spend and also feel as if I am building a meaningful and cohesive collection that I can enjoy long-term – regardless of its present or future value.


Collecting history, one commemorative coin (or medal) at a time!
Original content (c) Commems, 2012-2018
Pillar of the Community
Canada
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 Posted 08/10/2018  12:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add JGG to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I bought mine for $410 this year and now I am feeling that I overpaid.
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Canada
317 Posts
 Posted 08/10/2018  12:38 pm  Show Profile   Check jimper's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add jimper to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@JGG

You're not alone. Also if you buy anything through the RCM site you've over paid.Imo
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 Posted 08/10/2018  1:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The one RCM staff was very friendly at yesterday RCNA was much smaller in employees and space than the previous few shows, but the one person was especially concerned that the new NCLT seems to devalue instantly while the older staff member basically had the RCM attitude of someone buys our product, if you don't like them get out of here. The old adage, we make them. you buy them
Valued Member
Canada
444 Posts
 Posted 08/10/2018  2:56 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chadcoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Torex Session 4 and lots 1587 to 1591 are the Glass Butterflies. I expect these lots to tank, why sell 5 at once? I see there are many repetitive lots being sold like as if there just getting dumped!!
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Canada
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 Posted 08/10/2018  3:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
At TOREX show a few weeks ago, dealers were either not interested or offered bullion value for nonpopular NCLT coins, the dealers not making offers were the real honest ones, there is just few buyers for most old NCLT coins. the Ladybug coin was like the poster boy example of what's good in NCLT until this last year or so
Edited by john100
08/10/2018 3:50 pm
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2187 Posts
 Posted 08/11/2018  01:00 am  Show Profile   Check canadian_coins's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add canadian_coins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@commems,

Stunning. Every single point in your missive resonates with me.

You are a passionate collector, and I always appreciate your posts.
A picture is worth a thousand words.
Edited by canadian_coins
08/11/2018 01:01 am
Valued Member
Canada
356 Posts
 Posted 08/11/2018  03:50 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barriecarson to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@commems,

I agree with canadian_coins. Great post!
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 Posted 08/11/2018  12:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Silveroid to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I like Commems's words post point 5.
Accumulation might easily to lead to failure in collecting.
For myself can say - after so many years of collecting and quiting and starting over, still can't understand, is "to collect" always means more than "to buy"? Did I collect my coins or simply bought?

I still enjoy all related to NCLT, exciting with every single release, but bought literally 3 items per year recently.

Additional observation, self-experienced: when you will try to sell, your over-accumulated items, you might discover, that interest to buy, even with deep discounts is very low over the world for majority of RCM or RM or RAM or Perth or NZM releases.
Valued Member
Canada
155 Posts
 Posted 08/11/2018  2:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add walk2dwater to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm not a coin collector. I've been collecting CDN pager money exclusively up to a few years ago when my partner bought me the 2017 "150" Canadian anniversary commemorative set. A friend of mine recommended another online auction site and I could not get over the amount of NCLT listed. So, seeing that banknotes were going far above book (with "tax/buyer's juice") I decided to put a few bids on the NCLT coinage. And I won a few items. The reason I'm confessing this is because I actually believe I paid too much on the coins I won until I saw a catalogue which showed I actually got a "deal" in most cases. [I don't understand why the pricing on NCLT is so high].

So: I had to search this site to determine what exactly is a 2011 "Ladybug" When I discovered that they came out for $149 but were selling for $500 I was quite amazed. Who would pay that much for a $20 colourized coin? Searching further, I learned quite a few apparently, and that the price went north again (up to $1000?) The fact that the price of the ladybug went this high, I feel, is freak phenomenon [& I'm still shocked].

If it went for $590 at RCNA I would say the market has normalized but is still relatively healthy considering that it did sell for above it's original RCM price. But perhaps it is a weaker market? I think we should keep in mind that there was a lot of very rare (1921 .50 cent piece/exceptionally rare/pricey banknotes) merchandise being auctioned over the course of the convention. It is no small wonder these auctions exhaust the pocketbooks of the collectors present (& online)!

I'm just chipping my 2 cents worth here because I feel these things (especially the marketplace for coins/paper) always show either stronger or weak phases. I am pretty amazed at the overinflated prices RCM lists their products for & agree that their themes leave one scratching his/her head. Now they're minting stuff that's hardly a coin (3D bears?) Not sure whether they've kept their QC up to snuff and all that- but I'm pretty certain that a huge part of their product goes to the lazy collector (or relation to a collector) who's not interested in doing his/her due diligence in discovering what piece is rare/or what grades are scarce, etc. The fact that they've created so many various products (and released at high mintages) with mind-boggling pop themes and still have people buy up the stuff is remarkable to me.
Edited by walk2dwater
08/11/2018 4:30 pm
Pillar of the Community
Canada
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 Posted 08/11/2018  7:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
For many years the Ladybug coin was selling for well over 1200 and sometimes more than 1500 but the last two years most of the popular NCLT has started the downward spiral to bullion. Since the RCM does do sell out about 2/3 of their issues, it must goes to mainly new collectors and in a few years find there is no aftermarket, most will leave the hobby. Yes the 1921 50 cent piece went for only 126000 with juice, although not a good graded 64 it in my opinion did poorly too, while cool error notes and rare notes just keep on trucking.
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