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Resubmission Of January Question (Degrees Of Cleaning)

 
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 Posted 09/26/2006  9:24 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Morgan Fred to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Hi again, James. I'm reissuing this topic for which you ran out of time to answer in January, so it's come back to haunt you. It is in regard to clarification of the degrees of cleaned coins. This is not a simple topic to address, so you might want to defer.

http://goccf.com/t/3235

Fred

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 Posted 09/26/2006  9:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Susanlynn9 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here is the post by Morgan Fred in its entirety rather than using the link above:

The subject of cleaned coins is controversial and is subject to wide varieties of opinions for the simple reason that there are dozens or hundreds of degrees of "cleaning", especially among Mint State coins . While it is usually obvious when a coin has been harshly cleaned with an abrasive such as Ajax or steel wool (at one end of the spectrum), often a coin has been very lightly cleaned with a non-abrasive non-reactive material such as water and/or simply swept with a small camel's hair brush (at the other end of the spectrum). This problem is exacerbated by the date of cleaning; some coins were cleaned perhaps 100 to 200 years earlier and have since "naturalized". Many of us have submitted coins (mostly Morgans in my instance) which have apparent full luster, cartwheel nicely, and appear otherwise to be uncirculated Mint State fresh-off-the-press with no evidence of surface tampering only to have them returned as "cleaned". There also does not appear to be any consistent standards among grading companies and even within a single grading company on these coins in question; a resubmission of a nice "cleaned" coin will sometimes be returned as an MS. Similarly, coins have been submitted for which a provenance is established with no cleaning history, yet the coin is returned as cleaned. Compounding this whole situation are those ultra-rare coins which probably have been cleaned, but are graded and slabbed anyway; I refer to the USS Republic coins but also many late 1700s or early 1800s coins. What would ANACS do with, say, an 1804 Draped Bust Dollar which is just discovered, but had been rubbed down with a chamois cloth?

Would it be possible for ANACS to lighten up on the "cleaned" evaluation of a coin without relaxing its grading standards in all other respects? I.e., if a coin is so pristine that it is so difficult to determine if it has been cleaned or not, could it not be given the benefit of the doubt? Following this train of thought, could ANACS establish and publish a set of criteria, definitions, and or standards for cleaned coins?
Knowledge is the key to collector success!
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United States
98 Posts
 Posted 09/26/2006  9:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add James Taylor to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Fred,

I'm afraid I would have to take up half of the time that remains answering your important question. Please forward it to me at my personal e-mail so I can devote the proper time it requires. I hope you understand.

James
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 Posted 09/26/2006  9:56 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Morgan Fred to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
James, you got mail.
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218 Posts
 Posted 09/29/2006  12:36 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add The_Cave_Troll to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by Morgan Fred

James, you got mail.



Please post his reply here for us to see. Thanks!
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 Posted 11/26/2006  8:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Morgan Fred to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
For the record, James never did get back to me and now I guess he never will.

Fred
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 Posted 07/25/2012  3:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Indian1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Almost 6 yrs. since any reply on this one.
I just found it myself.
I had a similar post just recently.

I think James wants Carly back so he has been busy.
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 Posted 11/21/2018  11:35 pm  Show Profile   Check GrapeCollects's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add GrapeCollects to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

My best finds: 1999-WAM:http://goccf.com/t/332161 1988-RDV-6:http://goccf.com/t/335954#2873459 1986-Off-center: http://goccf.com/t/335952
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 Posted 11/22/2018  1:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kopper Ken to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't like the term "cleaned"...if done properly the coins are going through a "conservation," similar to what museums do. Is every ancient coin that is sold, believed to be "original"...?

KK
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