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How Do You Correctly Illuminate Macro Shots In Indirect Sunlight?

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Brandmeister's Avatar
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 Posted 10/06/2023  11:54 am Show Profile   Check Brandmeister's eBay Listings Bookmark this topic Add Brandmeister to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers




So I got another $8 Amazon lens for my iPad, this time a macro lens. I really like the resolution and clarity for full coin photos. However, I have a really n00b photography problem. When I get super close to the coin for the photos, I inevitably cast a shadow on the coin.

How do I get uniform lighting across the coin in a macro setup, particularly in indirect sunlight?
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John1's Avatar
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 Posted 10/06/2023  12:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Handheld LED flashlight with a filter over it?
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 Posted 10/10/2023  11:04 pm  Show Profile   Check Brandmeister's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Brandmeister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I was just watching a short YouTube video about a tiny 3D printed axial photography box for coins, and I stumbled across this old CCF thread: http://goccf.com/t/411871

If you can use an LED light on the glass, is it also possible to just reflect sunlight into the box using a mirror, or admit indirect sunlight via a short tube and a hole?
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 Posted 10/10/2023  11:10 pm  Show Profile   Check Brandmeister's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Brandmeister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Also, I know this is a rookie photography question, but how does one handle the situation where the macro lens is super close to the subject? Is there a method for using angles other than 45 degrees? Don't be shy about the geometry or physics part of the explanation, that at least I will get. I do understand that the 45 degree angle is to illuminate evenly with reflected rays parallel through the camera-coin axis.
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 Posted 10/11/2023  10:49 pm  Show Profile   Check Brandmeister's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Brandmeister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Encouraged by some interesting results from a plastic and construction paper prototype, I upgraded my axial box to cardboard and real glass. I will have to wait for sunlight tomorrow, but I can see that the glass does indeed put some reflected light directly onto the middle of the coin. Not sure that I have the heights and widths set correctly yet, but it wasn't bad for an evening of tinkering.


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 Posted 10/12/2023  10:34 am  Show Profile   Check Brandmeister's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Brandmeister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply


Worked with the setup a bit this morning. I can get nice, even lighting on the front half of the coin. The back, which is furthest away from the opening and closest to the glass, doesn't seem to get much light. Even reflecting light into the box with a mirror just seems to light the front half more.

One of the challenges that I am realizing is that it's much easier to control the direction of an LED flashlight compared to the sun.

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 Posted 10/12/2023  2:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
One of the challenges that I am realizing is that it's much easier to control the direction of an LED flashlight compared to the sun.
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 Posted 10/12/2023  4:17 pm  Show Profile   Check Brandmeister's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Brandmeister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Ok, iteration III. I got a little tired of cardboard and scissors, so I switched to a pro-grade engineering prototype tool:




Light leakage allowed from the top:

Construction paper blocking around the lens, no leaked light from the top:

I had been reading about how you need some inconsistent light to bring out luster, but it was surprising to see that in action. I plan to do some experiments tonight with incandescent and fluorescent bulbs that I have on hand. The LED flashlight is actually pretty uneven on the small scale, with obvious bright glare right in the center. It also shines on the glass in a harsh way, making it partly visible.

Overall, I am happy with this little learning tool. I can tell that I need to locate a better camera app than the default iPad Camera software. It doesn't quite autofocus correctly, and it doesn't lock in the best focus, either.
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 Posted 10/12/2023  4:44 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Ok, iteration III. I got a little tired of cardboard and scissors, so I switched to a pro-grade engineering prototype tool:
Lego for the win!

I see improvement. Good luck with the continued testing!
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 Posted 10/12/2023  5:24 pm  Show Profile   Check Brandmeister's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Brandmeister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks, jbuck. =) I think if I am going to get the true richness of sunlight to work with this little box, what I will really need is some kind of reflector—maybe an old school flashlight reflector—to catch direct sunlight and align it right down the light tube. Also, some sort of secondary light inlet that I can selectively open and close to get luster.
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 Posted 10/13/2023  11:49 am  Show Profile   Check Brandmeister's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Brandmeister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply



More experimenting today. This time with direct sunlight on the kitchen table. Inexplicably, I had glass glare today, and for some reason could not get the bottom of the second nickel into focus.

My end goal here is to begin photographing my collection of modern WDDR nickels with lines in doors, with a focus on aesthetics.
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 Posted 10/13/2023  11:50 pm  Show Profile   Check Brandmeister's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Brandmeister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
So tonight I think I finally got the setup dialed in. I spent some time to cut black felt to cover the LEGO plastic almost everywhere in the axial box.

First test shots, Lincoln Shield cent, dim incandescent flashlight filtered through paper towel, to explore color and luster.

Lincoln Shield cent, incandescent lamp with no shade, filtered through paper towel.

New style 2005 Buffalo nickel, incandescent lamp with no shade, filtered through paper towel.


Immediately obvious are the reflections obscuring the bottom half of the coins. I covered almost everything inside the box, except for one edge where I just said to myself, "Nah, that will be out of the frame." So tomorrow I will disassemble the box and cover that edge with felt.

However, the Buffalo nickel is very evenly lit. Not too bright, but all details captured fairly well, and no pools of shadow. Autofocus still fights the setup a bit. My hope is that tomorrow, with some good tweaks, I will arrive at a good conclusion for prototype #3.
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 Posted 10/14/2023  11:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cptbilly to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you for sharing your R & D effort, Brandmeister.
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 Posted 10/14/2023  11:52 am  Show Profile   Check Brandmeister's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Brandmeister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Axial box repaired with felt covering the top gaps. That at least eliminated those multiple reflections between the shiny gray plastic and the glass. Image cropped with a circle around the coin. The setup isn't quite where I want it to be yet, but the light is falling more or less evenly on the coin. I can tell that I now need to do some work on the light source.

I would have worked on the lighting some more, but my dog informed me that emergency snuggles were required OR ELSE.

I also need to locate a free app to control the basic focus options on the iPad camera. Even the tiniest flicker in the light source causes the autofocus to jump uncontrollably. The picture above isn't quite in focus, but for whatever reason, the AF function would pass through what was clearly a crisp focus before settling on something just a touch away from perfect. I think the image resize app to fit the 300kB forum limit is also suboptimal. All the recommended apps in photography articles have $$$ monthly subscriptions and about a zillion options, widgets, filters. There is surely a much simpler free solution, but it will require some more research.

cptbilly, I am happy to share my research. I have been impressed with your coin photos, but I imagine your setup is something rather superior to LEGO bricks and felt. =)
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