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 Replies: 21 / Views: 3,366 |
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Valued Member
United States
458 Posts |
Old ladies? Wrong. Children? Never. Newbies? Depends on the age, honestly.
Its a dog eat dog world out there, and if you know something someone else does not, good for you!
Let's be honest, okay? There are a lot of REALLY REALLY unintelligent and ignorant people out there. There is a reason he was offering those prices to you - people sell their silver and gold for those low prices all the time for numerous reasons (Need the money now, want the money now, dont really care what they get for the coins bc they were given/inherited and they just want to get some fast $$$, etc etc).
I am against preying on the very elderly and the young. As for everyone else, go read a book and educate yourself!
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1391 Posts |
BuffalosRock, I wrote out a longer reply, but if you can not see that the previous posters are not promoting the ripping off old ladies, kids and newbies, then there is probably little to say.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3184 Posts |
I dislike the people trying to rip others off to make a buck! 10x...........come on! The hotel gold buyers are the worse!
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
BuffalosRock...I've followed & responded to several of your posts on this subject. You seem to have strong opinions as to what is & isn't an acceptable level of profit. This may seem a little bit out of left field, but I'm curious as to what you do for a living? It has to be an unusual field for it to fit within what you have stated is an acceptable level of profit.
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Valued Member
United States
227 Posts |
It only becomes "ripping someone off" when the dealer starts creating lies or counterfeits a product to confuse the seller. The dealer deliberately trying to deceive the buyer regarding the market value was wrong, but the offer of 10x itself is NOT. It is the individual job of both the buyer and seller to know what they are buying or selling. As a seller, it is not my responsibility to inform you of what your item is worth... I mean come on that doesn't make any sense! Saying "I'll give you $50 for your silver" when its been going for $200 is just the dealer trying to get a good deal. No one is forcing the other guy to sell it at $50. But, if that's what its worth in the seller's mind, then they both complete the transaction and leave happy. This type of thing happens all the time on ebay and no one thinks its wrong at all... in fact we applaud people who get nice coins at a fraction of "FMV". There are of course gray areas in ethics always but in general a lowball offer is not morally wrong. Remember precious metals are only worth what people are willing to pay, and that value is free to change based on whatever beliefs or disbeliefs people may have. FMV is just a general idea, not something written in stone that people have to abide by. Just how I look at it... |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
500 Posts |
Preying on others ignorance is just not justifiable. To claim "they should know" is unbackable. No one is an expert at every field, so there is a chance that anyone can get ripped off when they happen to go outside their expertise zone. That's why I mentioned the golden rule. Do you feel "I deserved to be ripped off" when it happens to you? Or your mom? wife? kids? I don't think it is "explained away as dog-eat-dog" in any sense.
Is it okay for a street vendor to charge a "slow kid" $20 bucks for flowers that they charge $5 for to everyone else? That too is "maximizing profit", right? Ethics are in short supply! Lowballing the ignorant and profiling them just is not ethical business practices. Doesn't matter who is doing it and who is the "mark". As I said, maybe tomorrow it is YOU! Not cool!
At a coin show last week I saw an elderly man hand a dealer a wad of cash and ask him to take out what he owed him. The dealer could have easily taken an extra 20 or two and the guy wouldn't have known it. He didn't but it really does bother me that for some of you had he taken advantage that would have been "okay". That predatory kind of attitude is offensive. And to me, offering 10X was just as heinous an attempt to rip off as stealing is. That it "works on some" doesn't justify it. And when the owner lies and says they don't do it and that I must be lying? That crosses the ethics line completely, IMO.
JMHO
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
Quote:
There is a line between making a profit and a legit bargain and crossing over to preying on others ignorance or innocent mistake. I think way too many people cross that line these days and that makes the whole hobby suffer - and mistrust ABOUND. It is a bit sad really. But keep justifying ripping off old ladies and kids and newbies, ethics be damned. Quote:
At a coin show last week I saw an elderly man hand a dealer a wad of cash and ask him to take out what he owed him. The dealer could have easily taken an extra 20 or two and the guy wouldn't have known it. He didn't but it really does bother me that for some of you had he taken advantage that would have been "okay". I'll tell you what I find offensive. Someone who obviously has no idea of what goes into running a business decides he knows everything about what is & isn't an acceptable profit margin, expounds on it repeatedly & then makes totally uncalled for & derogatory remarks about people who don't agree. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3692 Posts |
Beware of those places advertising that "gold is at an all-time high" and who don't update their commercials in years or use other gimmicks like dancing ladies or costumes the way car dealers sometimes do.
There are generally two ways of selling. Playing dumb or playing smart. If you can play smart and still get the price you were looking for then you know you've found a good place to sell. If you play dumb you also have to expect them to treat you the same.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
561 Posts |
Quote:
I'll tell you what I find offensive. Someone who obviously has no idea of what goes into running a business decides he knows everything about what is & isn't an acceptable profit margin, expounds on it repeatedly & then makes totally uncalled for & derogatory remarks about people who don't agree.  Not sure I could have come up with a better response. Thank you! You sumed up my feelings perfectly. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
561 Posts |
Was going to leave this alone but the more I think about your post, the more offensive I find it. Your examples are absolutely absurd. Quote:
Is it okay for a street vendor to charge a "slow kid" $20 bucks for flowers that they charge $5 for to everyone else? Since the "slow kid" lacks the mental capacity to enter into a legal and binding contract (of which a purchase is), that is not ok. Nobody here has ever advocated for such a thing as far as I can recall. Please point me to the post where someone did if that is the case. Quote:
At a coin show last week I saw an elderly man hand a dealer a wad of cash and ask him to take out what he owed him. The dealer could have easily taken an extra 20 or two and the guy wouldn't have known it. He didn't but it really does bother me that for some of you had he taken advantage that would have been "okay". Again, this would be theft. Theft is a crime and nobody on this forum has ever advocated committing a crime in order to "maximize profit" as you put it. If they have I would love to have you point out where. Am I breaking some kind of law when I try to negotiate a price with a seller whether it be a "business" or a private individual? Afterall I am only trying to maximize the amount of money in my bank account but I do it all the time. Sometimes the business/individual is willing to sell an item at a price lower than they have advertised and other times they aren't. In my humble opinion, you are a fool if you have never attempted to negotiate the price of goods or services at any point in your life. As long as neither party makes false and/or misleading statements AND both parties are free from duress then there is absolutely nothing wrong with the free negotiation of an exchange of goods/money. You have yet to cite a single example of anything close to dishonest or unethical. I have to agree with a previous poster, it would be very interesting to know what you do for a living given your obvious hatred of free market capitalism. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1348 Posts |
If someone walks into a G&S place without doing any research and are offered 8-10x face then it is their fault. What happened when there was no Internet? people still went to the library to research things. What I mean is that today it is so easy to find the price of anything. My dad called me yesterday and needed to know the melt value of steel rods he had on his farm. All he had was how wide they were by how long. Within 5 minutes I had the weight of each foot of steel and the going rate at scrap yards. It is to easy to not get taken advantage of these days................... On the other hand, I know we have all see American Pickers, pawn stars, and other type television shows. When Frank and Mike go to a property and buy a leather jacket for $75 and value you it at $350 I don't see a problem with it. This G&S place offered around half of the melt price. do I think that's a fair price? no, but I don't think he was robbing you. It it the seller's responsibility to get the best price and the dealer's responsibility to get the best price. If you do your homework usually you both walk away happy. If you get scammed it probably your own fault and negotiating skills, and the dealer makes a better profit that day. let the blowback begin  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
Here's a link to another thread started by the OP of this thread. Take careful note of the second paragraph. It's obviously ok to buy items for half of FMV when you are "bargain hunting"......but I can't tell the difference between that & cherry picking and/or a dealer buying for 50% of FMV. https://goccf.com/t/122197 |
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Locked
822 Posts |
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Valued Member
United States
366 Posts |
I think it pays to shop around and not sell to the first place you go to. And also --> Buyer beware.
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Valued Member
United States
366 Posts |
I'd only have a problem with shops buying at 50% FMV if they are advertising and telling patrons that they offer the highest prices paid. Otherwise it's pretty much fair game.
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Replies: 21 / Views: 3,366 |
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Posted 06/15/2012 11:55 am
