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Macrinus And Diadumenian

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 Posted 01/15/2014  06:24 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add pishpash to your friends list
Hmm, Dwayne your link does not work, or it has been taken down in 27 minutes.
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Pillar of the Community
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 Posted 01/15/2014  06:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add FVRIVS RVFVS to your friends list
Very hard to determine with the small sized pics and a definitive answer would probably require close in hand examination. The Macrinus does look suspicious for being so very very perfect. Not impossible but certainly a reason to wonder. The fields just look so smooth I can see why someone might be skeptical. The Diadumenian looks to be less 'perfect' and has some rougher spots which make it a bit easier to 'swallow'. But a clever manufacturer of modern fakes would no doubt be smart enough to make some effort to 'age' his products. The combination of the two extremely rare Emperors in XF quality is another indicator too. Lets face it ..... make fakes of Severus Alexander and Gordian III and you need make quite a large pile to pay off all the lawyers.

I long ago simply threw in the towel and gave up on ancient silver. I found I could be fooled often enough that I no longer trusted my own opinions. Not a very happy condition. Fortunately the search for nicely patinated antique bronze has kept me quite busy for almost 30 years with no end in sight. There are bronze fakes too .... I just feel more confident about spotting them. Although even that is getting more difficult all the time
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 Posted 01/15/2014  06:50 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add dwayne8625 to your friends list
Sorry pish try now. Biancasdad I think it might be a die match.
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 Posted 01/15/2014  08:16 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add pishpash to your friends list
The Diadumenian is looking like a die match for the coin on forvmancientcoins Toronto Group forgeries. Did you buy both coins together?
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 Posted 01/15/2014  08:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list
to the community

I would have liked to seen slightly larger pictures, but what I can tell from these I don't see anything wrong with either coin. They are well centered and well struck, with as struck details. While not common in this condition, they do exist. What is he size and weight of each coin?
New Member
United Kingdom
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 Posted 01/15/2014  09:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dipsius to your friends list
The Diadumenian is certainly a die match for the Toronto group fake. The Macrinus, on the other hand, just seems too good to be true. There are very few examples online, and none of them are in anything like such good condition as this one. That doesn't mean that it is a fake, of course, but it does set alarm bells ringing. Larger photos and size and weight would help a bit.
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 Posted 01/15/2014  09:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bacchus2 to your friends list
Yes - I'm afraid the news is not good for these two coins.
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 Posted 01/15/2014  12:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list
They are very well made, they looked real to me from just the pictures.
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 Posted 01/15/2014  12:59 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ShowMeTheMagic to your friends list
Wow, so many answers so quickly! I REALLY appreciate ALL of you! One thing I've noticed is on those fakes you've linked me to, they look (for lack of better word) blotchy. The lettering is not as sharp as the coins I presented. Yes, they very well may be from the same dies, but why would the ones I have be struck so sharp and clear, when the others are so dull and, well, blotchy? (Really, I can't think of a better word, at the moment.) And please don't think I'm questioning your expertise in this matter. I turned to all of you exactly for that reason... your expertise! One of you asked if I bought them together. No, I did not. I bought them well over 5 years ago, many months apart and from two completely unrelated sources. Luckily, that was at a time when the Roman coins weren't as outrageously expensive as they are these days. And, it would appear I got snookered on both. Well, I'm not going to lose any sleep over it. You live, you learn, you move on. Anyone interested in a couple really nice forged coins, one Macrinus denarius and one Diadumenian denarius? I have a fantastic Orbiana fake, too, but I knew it was fake from the start. I'm open to offers. If not, then they'll all just get put into storage... CLEARLY labeled so that if anything should happen to me, my heirs won't think they've got a couple real moneymakers on their hands! THANK YOU ALL again for the guidance and input! It truly is appreciated!
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 Posted 01/15/2014  1:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ShowMeTheMagic to your friends list
And someone asked the weights and sizes... they are: Macrinus 2.95g / 16mm, Diadumenian 2.68g / 15mm. Sorry I missed that question in my previous reply.
Edited by ShowMeTheMagic
01/15/2014 1:05 pm
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 Posted 01/15/2014  1:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add pishpash to your friends list
You can always spend some money by sending them for authentication to someone like David Sear if you think it would be worth your while.
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 Posted 01/15/2014  3:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bacchus2 to your friends list
For me there is a crudity in their appearance that sparked off the red flags. It's difficult to describe but the images are naive - or not done with the quality and finesse I would have expected.
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 Posted 01/15/2014  3:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add FVRIVS RVFVS to your friends list
The coins can easily look different from others produced from the same dies for the mere fact that people will go to some length to rough them up to disguise the 'facts'. A Diadumenian with some rough and tumble nicks and dents. Or maybe even a touch of acid to take off some of the buff newly made looks will make it hard for even an experienced collector to spot. As I was inferring previously the real money comes from making valuable coins. Silver denari of Severus Alexander in F go for $20. A silver denari of someone 'unusual' (Diadumenian or Macrinus) can fetch a few hundred even with some issues (bumps and bruises).

I enlarged the pics a bit and stood back aways (5ft). Macrinus looks very familiar. They list quite a few similar ones to this over in the German ebay. The 'experts' frequently cite Serbia as the source of these. It may be there are several places putting them out.

I often wonder (especially with the shananigans I hear people attributing to SOME of the more notorious coin grading services) Why spend money on advertising for a coin grading service ? Better bang for the buck by sending someones cousin over in someplace in the world the money and equipment to knock out high quality fakes. Then the customers who scare easily will all come running to use that low cost low budget fly by night coin grading service that you set up in the basement !
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 Posted 01/15/2014  5:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chrsmat71 to your friends list
my first thought was "fake" when I saw them. I'm not familiar with the coins, but a perfect strike, no wear, and comepletely homogenous looking surface just don't look right on a ancient coin.
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