This Is A New Approach On Ebay Listing...

I've seen this discussed on two different forums now and on both of them the consensus has been that the seller is doing something terrible and possibly perpetrating a scam by covering up the information on the label.

Strange, I seem to recall a LOT of people always saying "Buy the coin not the holder! Buy the coin not the holder!". So here we have a seller who shows a coin in a good holder and says "Look at the coin and come to your own decision and bid accordingly." And everyone gets upset. I guess what they meant was "Buy the coin, not the holder, but buy the coin based on what the holder says."

One person went as far as to imply that a buyer would have to be insane to buy a coin based only on a decent picture. (Even though they offer a 14 day return priviledge.) Well that is now a huge number of raw coins are sold, and there are a lot of people who seen to be perfectly willing to assign grades to pictures of coins posted on line. So look at the picture and decide if you want the coin and what you are willing to pay BASED ON YOUR OPINION! (When did we degenerate to the point where we are now TOTALLY dependent of the TPG's opinion? I guess it must be true that no one knows how to grade anymore.)

And he is telling the truth that it is not in a details holder. Look at the back label. There is no photoshopping on the label under the hologram. A details slab says "Authentic not gradable" on the back label.



And what would you suggest you do when you have a slab where you don't agree with the grade? You could crack it out and sell it raw. But then you lose the assurance that the coin in genuine. You could show the slab with their opinion and then state what you think the grade is, and every one will ignore you because they have become too dependent on the TPG gods and you will get less than the coin is worth if you are right. Or you might try showing it in the slab with the info blocked out and tell people to look at the coin and come to their own decision as to what it grades. (You will note he doesn't blank it out and tell you what he thinks it is, he lets you make the decision.)

Too bad, if their opinion is good enough to authenticate the coin than its certainly good enough to grade it. Conversely if yours is good enough to grade it then it should be good enough to authenticate it.

This is picking and choosing what part of the TPG opinion matters based on how it serves your needs best, it doesn't work like that. It either matters or it doesn't. If it matters the whole label matters, if it doesn't nothing about the slab matters.

EDIT: I also agree with Darth that if one is going to make a case to a coin being under graded you should absolutely be showing everything up front. Blurring labels is just trying to see how badly you can con someone into over paying for higher grade levels. Under grading does happen, but when its consistently "happening" to the same seller over and over its not the TPGs grading thats the problem.

That's the loudest slab I've ever seen! Does anyone else have a headache?

The only hole in that theory is, it's not possible to realistically assess the coin in an auction image. I'm fairly experienced with coin photography, and I don't feel I get truly accurate images from which I could expect an accurate assessment more than half of the time without multiple sets from different lighting angles. That's the thing so few seem to get about digital coin photography. The seller in question here has presented decent images, but they're insufficient to conclusively determine between AU and MS. It's my opinion that he thinks the coin to be Mint State but PCGS disagreed.

The "right" way to do this is to present the PCGS grade as-given, and your reasoned counterpoint in the auction copy. Anything else smacks of deception.

Guess we know now.

Im actually with you on this but like before it will depend on the situation. Simply cracking a coin isn't a tar and feathering offense, to be honest if anything PCGS is over conservative on what gets hit with details grades and there are a decent number of those that could easily go either way.

With that said though its all going to be how its sold from that point. If the coin just pictured without really saying anything letting it stand on its own or is it someone taking AU cleaned or MS cleaned and trying to pass them off as beautiful lustrous coins. Or is it a market graded vf details thats really an xf by technical standpoint that the seller is making no claims of being problem free.

The key is whether or not their is a deceptive effort to significantly pump up the value to an unsuspecting buyer.
We all know a raw 500+ or 1k+ coin at a big seller is basically the unofficial way of saying this would be a details coin, but some represent them much more honestly than others. Then of course their the worst of the worst who buy details coins specifically to crack and misrepresent who deserve every last word said about them.

I would also go back to my other point of how often is this happening with a seller. If its something that happens from time to time, its not unreasonable that it could happen if everything else from the seller is on the up and up. Again though, if this is a consistent problem theyre having its not the TPGs making the mistakes.

Dave, I was being sarcastic. LOL I DO see your point, but I think that good pics are enough to give me enough of an idea to make a reasonable decision. In the particular case at hand, I think those pics were more than sufficient to make an educated decision.