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Rainbow Alligator Eye... U Vs PCGS... ***updated Grade***

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 Posted 03/16/2015  12:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list
Here she is and my apologies but she is a VAM 12a with the clashes... I though she deserved at least 64-65 too but with my loop I can see that 2 spots, one on each side of the wings, is some kind of gunk with fibers in it...
My next question is did it effect the grade? Should I send it in for "conservation" (havent done a conserve sub yet) and will that bump the grade to what it should be? Thanks guys!

Rainbow-Alligator-Eye...-U-Vs-PCGS...-***updated-Grade***

Rainbow-Alligator-Eye...-U-Vs-PCGS...-***updated-Grade***

Rainbow-Alligator-Eye...-U-Vs-PCGS...-***updated-Grade***
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 Posted 03/16/2015  12:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list

Quote:
and why would this be "questionable"


The degree of coverage - coin about completely covered including devices - and the splotchy progression of colors are both red flags for a TPG. The color progressions of toning as it deepens obey the laws of physics and are known, and generally the "known natural" toning on a Morgan develops by patterns related to where the toning happened, in a Mint bag or an album.

There are exceptions, and if I had this coin in hand I'd be prepared to consider it natural.
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 Posted 03/16/2015  12:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list
Thanks SD, once again you chime in aND confirm my novice mental exercise game of what did that mean?... My guess to what he was talking about was because the coverage of the color was even like the coin could have been in a fluid or something.
So what do u think pcgs thought about it giving it a 62? And what do u think I should do about the gunk, does this coin have a shot at 64-65+ while keeping it's color if I send it in to conservation?
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 Posted 03/16/2015  1:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list
Oh, and does it give this coin even more of a premium having complete rainbow coverage being slabbed ms?... is there a premium being a highly collected VAM in such colorful appearance? Do all these factors add up to a huge premium?
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 Posted 03/16/2015  1:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CopperCastle to your friends list

Quote:
does this coin have a shot at 64-65+ while keeping it's color if I send it in to conservation?


Conservation prevents coins from further detriment of existing contaminates that may result if contaminates are left untreated.
Edited by CopperCastle
03/16/2015 1:18 pm
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 Posted 03/16/2015  1:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list
It's about the *amount* of coverage. You don't see Morgans so completely covered in color that often, and when they are the pattern doesn't usually look like this. PCGS obviously saw it as OK; good on them. As to the grade, though....

It's really difficult to shoot colorful Morgans at a gradable level. The ding below the eye is so prominent as to be worth maybe half a point itself, but with what I have here I don't see a 62 either. Highly doubtful it would break 64 under the best of conditions, conserved or not. It made a righteous PCGS slab; that's all you need here.

Seek out Todd Pollock of BluCC Photos. He posts here occasionally. He's based out of Sacto but hits all the major shows, and nobody alive can bring out color in a coin any better than he can. I'm betting that coin doesn't really need to worry about a grade to make you some money if that's your wish. It's a popular VAM because it's common, on a major List and available in high grades. Yours is toned in a good slab, and your thinking that the color will attract a premium is accurate. As long as it's depicted as favorably as it can be.
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 Posted 03/16/2015  1:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list
So a coin with some gunk on it that can be removed with acetone or what have u will grade the same as if there was no gunk? That doesn't make sense to me?
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 Posted 03/16/2015  2:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list
I'm unsure what those areas are - I'm seeing what you are - but worried that conserving the coin will cost the color. I would like to say "no way PCGS would slab that with true "crud" on it," but I can't.

This is one I'd keep exactly as it is. The more I look at it - including the area you're worried about - the more I wonder how it got into a good slab.
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 Posted 03/16/2015  2:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list
message received. Thanks SD... one more question- what's going on with the "o" of god? Looks almost like a filled die? I know the toning is in play with that letter but look how very shallow, almost non existent it is compared to the G & d...

Rainbow-Alligator-Eye...-U-Vs-PCGS...-***updated-Grade***

Rainbow-Alligator-Eye...-U-Vs-PCGS...-***updated-Grade***
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 Posted 03/17/2015  12:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list
Just giving this a bump to get ppls thoughts on if the O is a grease dill or ?
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 Posted 03/17/2015  06:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add dave700x to your friends list
I believe you have a VAM-12A, the clashed version. Look at the first full plate reverse photo and you'll see the same O.
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 Posted 03/17/2015  09:39 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list
Oops missed that. You would think it would be a minor diagnostic for the 12a being so prominent.
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 Posted 03/17/2015  09:59 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add TJsCoins to your friends list
Nice coin! I would leave it as is.
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 Posted 03/17/2015  11:36 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list
Minor diagnostic, but perhaps just a partial Grease Fill (what it looks like to me). Could have filled three or thirty thousand examples in varying degrees of depth - I'll bet money there's one out there with a complete fill. So, maybe just a note in the VAM listing. All the same, yours looks to be a stronger fill than the plate 12A, indicating a progression. This ought to be a topic at VAMworld, to clear that point up and get any necessary edits on the page. As they describe it, VAM-12 is a "gateway" coin and the listing needs to be as accurate as possible.

I don't often recommend bringing coins over to VAMworld, but this is one.
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 Posted 03/17/2015  12:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list
I'm growing in leaps and bounds like a Chia pet on miracle grow here and you say my coin can be used as teaching tool. Thats awesome! How should I proceed SD to "bring it to VW"? Do I need to take better pics and angles or is this something you're going to do with these pics or ?
Thanks SD & yes, I was thinking the same thing in my mental exercise of what else could it be besides a die fill but had no idea that sooo many could be produced before the foreign matter was ejected. Once again you put a bow on things
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