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"Rare Coin" Definition.

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Pillar of the Community
United States
1839 Posts
 Posted 01/31/2017  8:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Tbone to your friends list
The Sheldon rarity scale is the one that I think most people are thinking of when they talk about rarity. PCGS came up with their own and it's quite a bit looser than the Sheldon scale but it's also a lot more detailed. I kind of like it actually.

http://www.PCGScoinfacts.com/Conten...arity&s=4520
Edited by Tbone
01/31/2017 8:26 pm
Pillar of the Community
United States
677 Posts
 Posted 01/31/2017  9:41 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add schmidty to your friends list
I really like that scale Tbone. I hadn't seen it before. Thanks for sharing!
Pillar of the Community
United States
5854 Posts
 Posted 02/01/2017  01:19 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add D0ubl3Eagle to your friends list
There isn't really any definition on what is considered rare. I think much depends on what it is being compared to. Patterns as a whole are rare when compared to federal issues but within the specialty, a pattern probably needs to be in the single digits to be considered rare. The 1909-S VDB is common as far as key dates go but rare in the context of lincoln cents. The 1884-S morgan in MS is rare compared to itself in lower grades.
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Australia
16839 Posts
 Posted 02/01/2017  08:25 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list
To my mind, "rare" has to be linked to how difficult something is to obtain, which is in turn linked to both supply and demand.

If one can choose from multiple examples of the coin, in whichever condition one feels like purchasing, simply by doing a quick search on ebay or popping in to visit your local coin dealer, then the coin Is. Not. Rare.

If you've been searching for a coin on ebay for months and never finding it, in any condition, and the local coin dealer says they've only seen one or two in their entire life, and you need to scour through the Prices Realised sections of the major auction houses to find out what the last ones on the market were sold for, then yes, you can legitimately call your target coin "rare".
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
Pillar of the Community
Canada
849 Posts
 Posted 02/01/2017  09:54 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add punman to your friends list

Quote:
To my mind, "rare" has to be linked to how difficult something is to obtain, which is in turn linked to both supply and demand.


I am not sure if I am in total agreement with that one. Suppose a particular coin was released in a quantity of 5,000 and there are 5,000 people each owning one. Let us suppose that most of those 5,000 people do not want to sell that coin. That coin is not rare, it is simply not widely available and hard to obtain.

Now let us suppose that I make three identical sculptures. They are rare. There are only three like that in the world. I am not famous and they are not very well made and I have been trying to sell them for cheap for many months but no takers. That item is extremely rare, but openly available and not sought after.

I agree that supply and demand determine price and actual value, but I do not think that supply and demand, in and of themselves determine what is or is not rare.
Edited by punman
02/01/2017 10:01 am
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts
 Posted 02/01/2017  1:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list
Since no one really knows how many of any one coin still exists except for those so uncommon they are in museums, none of those scales mean much. To me a RARE coin is one I don't have yet.
Valued Member
United States
434 Posts
 Posted 03/03/2017  05:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DrDarryl to your friends list

Quote:
--curios as to the groups thoughts......


1. A comparable chart on the rarity scales (link below).

2. Key point that this author makes is "The Rarity Scales ONLY MEASURE KNOWN PIECES EXTANT; they do not address quality."

http://www.thehistorybank.com/persp...may10_4.html
Valued Member
United States
434 Posts
 Posted 03/03/2017  06:05 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DrDarryl to your friends list
Another good read ... (by Q. David Bower)

http://old.stacksbowers.com/NewsMed...y-Scale.aspx
CCF Advertiser
United States
1533 Posts
 Posted 03/03/2017  07:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Andrew99 to your friends list
There are many examples of easy to find coins that have high demand and high prices - 1909S VDB cent, 1916 SLQ, High Relief Saint. These are abundant and have high demand. Not rare at all. Then there are R7 patterns (3-4 examples known) that bring $3-$4K at auction, but you only see once every few years. If they ever get into strong collector hands, it could be a decade before you see one again. But nobody collects these anymore. There is tons of exonumia that is extremely rare that nobody collects, political buttons and the like. If you are looking for something specific, it could take a long time for these.
Valued Member
United States
336 Posts
 Posted 03/03/2017  12:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add EconBrony to your friends list
Anything a seller posts on ebay magically becomes rare ;)
Pillar of the Community
United States
6370 Posts
 Posted 03/03/2017  6:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add TypeCoin971793 to your friends list
For me, rare means that it will show up for sale no more than three times a year for world and ancients, and no more than 10-15 times per year for US (much more buying and flipping going on for US than any other market).

If you look at "rare" key date coins, you will see that there are often hundreds of them available at any given time.
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Belgium
506 Posts
 Posted 03/04/2017  10:01 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Gwyde to your friends list
When estimating the 'demand side' there are several key elements that anyone should list while talking about rarity.
- Does the political entity having issued the coins still exist? (and does it still have minting rights?)
- Is the currency the coin has been issued in still used in that country or region?
- Has the coin been circulating very long before being withdrawn?
- Is it a 'numismatic' issue which was not meant for circulation?

After political entities cease to exist (or lose minting rights) their issues quickly turn into niche markets most often at the expense of demand.

Coins issued in a former currency often are less sought after. Especially if the currency was replaced because of high inflation, small denominations in the former currency are not worth handing in. The supply overhang may prevent any price appreciation.

In the Euro-area, coins denominated in former currency most often aren't worth the euro-equivalent of their face value any longer. Especially in those countries where the transition period was short, there is a supply overhang.
Pillar of the Community
Norway
1358 Posts
 Posted 03/05/2017  3:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add UltraRant to your friends list

Quote:
a "rare coin" --do you base it on: value, mintage, year?


My answer is pretty simple, or so I think.

It starts with the mintage for one coin for a specific year. This is an absolute number, measurable. Then I add a time factor. A lot of coins get damaged beyond repair or lost over the years. Has the political entity been involved in a war or a situation where coins or precious metal has been confiscated on a large scale or structural basis and affected this coin? Add an extra rarity factor.

What you end up with is an estimate of how many of a coin are still available today. To me, that determines the rarity factor.

The value of a coin is a completely different thing. What I have observed over the years is that rarity might not even be a factor. Demand is a bigger factor. For example: I have a few Maltese mills coins with a mintage of way less than 5000. I found them in the junk bin at my coin dealer. No one wants them. I have a Norwegian coin of which 25000 pieces were made and a lot got lost during War and due to programs where silver coins were traded in for other money or assets. The price is about $100 nowadays, there might be about 2500 left, maybe less. Another sample is the Norwegian 2 Øre from 1968. It's a very hyped coin and only appeared in sets. Mintage is around 3500 pieces. They sell for $3000 a piece. So, that should clarify why to me value has nothing to say about rarity.

Additionally, I found that the value of a coin is completely subjective and much bound to the geographical data connected to the coin: the closer to home, the higher the price (and the bigger the awareness and trade, usually). A coin is worth what one wants to pay for it, with the absolute minimum being usually either face value or melt value.
Valued Member
United States
411 Posts
 Posted 03/15/2017  11:27 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cuzzx to your friends list
rare to me is being about the same as most sellers on ebay.
it all comes down to how many I have in my collection.

Pillar of the Community
United States
3472 Posts
 Posted 03/15/2017  11:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nfine to your friends list
Rare - Unable to find it at any price.
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