Fake Or Not? 1787 New Jersey Penny

First, snook, welcome to the forum! We try to help everyone out here no matter what the question or need might be.

I'm no expert in US colonials, but a lot of things need to be considered before buying such a coin. First and most obvious: the coin is not in an encapsulation and hasn't been authenticated by a reputable third party grading service. A coin this old and potentially this valuable would probably have been authenticated by now.

Second, the source and history (provenance) must be evaluated. If the owner or seller says it was "found in an estate" (especially in Savannah, Georgia), then a red flag just went up. The liklihood of an old and/or valuable coin magically showing up in somebody's cigar box is far, far lower than being struck by lightning (1 in 13 million) or winning the Powerball lottery (1 in 25 to 150 million or a lot more). Further, such "estates" are usually appraised by a qualified person or company before being offered for sale to the public. There are many dozens (hundreds?) of fake colonials being offered on ebay as we speak. I was an informal coin appraiser for a number of years and of the thousands of coins I looked at, I did not find a single "rare" or even highly unusual coin (found some interesting tokens, however), much to the disappointment of the owners. Thus, the questions must be asked: where did the seller get this coin? How is it that so many "colonials" escaped collectors' hands until now?

Third, if it's being offered for sale, in what venue is the offer made? If on ebay, it is highly likely it is a fraud. Such old coins are most often sold through prestigious auction houses or highly reputable dealers. It is not often that local dealers have the opportunity to get their hands on such a specimen.

Fourth, I did a Google and came up with an ebay auction (an a number more) for a coin almost identical to this one: http://cgi.ebay.com/Coin-1787-Colon...10_W0QQitemZ160016524306QQihZ006QQcategoryZ528QQcmdZViewItem
I then did an Advanced Search on ebay for 1787 NJ colonials listed for completed auctions. This one and very few of the others offered any documentation that these were authentic colonials which goes to prove my point that without any certification process, the coins' authenticity is very much in doubt. There's a lot of people out there who are stamping out these "colonials" (and other fakes) by the thousands.

When somebody offers one in a top grading service (ANACS, PCGS, or ANACS) encapsulation, then you have assurance that it is genuine. However, buying one off ebay under these conditions is a huge risk.

Thanks for the replies and the welcome. I plan on being around a lot. I found this coin with a metal detector while searching around the foundation of a colonial era house the were demolishing in Salem New Jersey. It was in the inner wall laying between two bricks at a corner. I thought it was a large penny at first, but after wiping the coin off, saw it was a Nova Caesara penny. I'd found a few before, but nothing in this condition before. The ones I had found previously came out of the ground and were badly pitted and basically worthless. I plan on getting this one graded but I needed input as to whether it would be worth it or not, based on a general consensus as to if it was real or not. The surroundings of the coins find was in a protected area, sealed within an inner wall. I appreciate your inputs.

Yes you need to get that graded anacs,ngc or pgs You my have to wait be it will be worth it!! I grew up in up state NY a friend had copper coin he thought it was a pendent or cheap belt piece. I went back to Catskill in 1982 and someone from from suny Albany collage had seen it and make long story short its was 1 off the elephant coin almost perfect but the hole. He sold it for 25000.++ I was told by his brother

snook, under the circumstances of your discovery, it is all the more imperative that you get it authenticated. There are too many scenarios in which fake colonials come into discovery, but "salting" seemingly rare coins into old houses is certainly right up there.

Here's an example of a wannabe colonial "found in Savannah". The seller has sold hundreds of such colonials; they are almost certainly forgeries. If he/she (husband/wife team) had such a genuine treasure trove,the State of Georgia's Historic Preservation Division might have a few questions for them: http://cgi.ebay.com/1701-Colonial-T...ah_W0QQitemZ170020031760QQihZ007QQcategoryZ544QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

snook or anyone else who wants to get into this NJ colonial very deeply, here's a definitive source (Notre Dame) for information:
http://www.coins.nd.edu/ColCoin/Col...r.intro.html

To compare this 1787 NJ colonial copper with authenticated originals will take a lot of time, but this site seems to offer as good a selection of colonials as any for comparison. It also has in-depth history of NJ (and other) colonials.

Thanks to Doug Prather of the World Internet Numismatist Society (WINS) for his timely email containing the Notre Dame reference to colonials.

Fred

Hey Snook!! Welcome. Nice coin!!

We Have A New Member!!

Aidan, now we're getting into nomenclatural questions although you are technically correct. The US Constitution wasn't written until 1787 and not ratified until 1789. Until then, the Articles of Confederation governed the states (which still called themselves "colonies"; and some still do) and did not have adequate provisions for coinage. The first US-minted coins weren't authorized until the Coinage Act of 1792. Until that point and far beyond (into the 1850s) until US-minted coins predominated, the specie of the land was a conglomeration of coins: Mexican and Spanish reales, British pennies and pounds, French francs, and any other coin which the colonists could get their hands on including pre-Revolution and post-Revolution state, local, and bank issues. With some exceptions, most every coin minted on US soil before the US Mint started producing Half Dismes in 1792 and half-cents in 1793 may be considered "colonials" and are lumped into the "colonial" category more as a matter of convenience than as a practical matter.