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 Replies: 162 / Views: 12,389 |
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
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I get it, you guys are not believers in the value of gold and silver. This thread is becoming a big yawn. No ones questioned that it has value, just that it somehow is supposed to have astronomical values that its never had in history before |
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Valued Member
United States
380 Posts |
There is. There is a new and large bubble being created by the government and the Federal Reserve. Sure that looks like recovery for a while until is bursts. As long as unbacked dollars are created out of nothing with ferocity, the markets will soar and interest rates will stay pushed down. This cannot and will not last. Keep buying the PM's while the rest of the ignorant and manipulative dump them. Sheep.
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
1684 Posts |
Cyprus to sell gold reserves to help fund bailout http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22106187The sale will be the biggest bullion sale by a eurozone central bank since France sold 17.4 tonnes in the first half of 2009. |
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Valued Member
United States
329 Posts |
Yes they are creating alot of money, however they do a very good job of containing it. CB must keep the economies weak in order to make all that debt appear attractive, they accomplish this thorugh carry trades and swaps. QE has had the affect of lowering income and raising assets prices. Rather then being stimulative it actually causes a funk which is how you control inflation. Typically recoveries, and gold bear markets are built upon falling asset prices and rising incomes.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
36878 Posts |
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that it somehow is supposed to have astronomical values that its never had in history before I never said that. Just pointing out that for 5000 years gold and silver have been a store of value, many currencies have come and gone but those coins made of gold and silver have survived and preserved their value. Coin collectors should see that better than anyone else. Physical metals are held as a hedge against the reckless spending and creation of an unbacked fiat currency by nations. I do not see gold and silver as a get rich quick scheme, if you want that go to a casino or the stock market. It is simply a way to preserve some of your wealth from being inflated away or stolen by bankers and governments. The OP asked if Cyprus was a big event. I still believe it was as it has been stated by members of the EU that it is a model of things to come. I also showed that the largest withdrawal in history has taken place in the COMEX (Commodities Exchange) system regarding the storage of gold. Many people have lost trust in "the system". As time goes on we are going to see just how much money has been pulled out of bank accounts around the world since the theft of the money stored in Cyprus banks. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
36878 Posts |
Watch who gobbles up the 400M Euros of gold sold by Cyprus...Russia and China. As Greece was depleted of it's wealth, now Cyprus. They are picking EU countries off one at a time. Is Italy or Spain next?
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
616 Posts |
Indian
I am not going to dispute what you said but in a digital world where value is transferred by bits I can't help be wonder if this doesn't change the dynamics for currencies. Also I have done some research on why gold and silver became value stores and so far the answers I have found don't give me the feeling that the value of PMs is guaranteed in perpetuity especially in a digital world. That said I think the purchase of physical PMs as a prudent move as long as it it part of a broader strategy.
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Valued Member
United States
329 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
1684 Posts |
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...to-23bn.htmlThe financial crisis ravaging Cyprus deepened on Thursday after the cost of the country's bail-out surged from €17.5bn to €23bn - larger than the size of the country's economy. Cyprus is now having to find €13bn to secure €10bn from the EU and the IMF. Previously it was thought that Cyprus would only have to raise €7.5bn The Cypriot developments came as Portugal was disclosed to be facing a second bail-out. Currently, the country will owe the EU and IMF €78bn in bail-out loans when it has to return to the financial markets for financing in July next year. But the documents showed that this will be nigh on impossible because Portugal will need to borrow €14.1bn in 2014, 30pc more annually than before the bail-out, at higher interest costs than those that caused its initial crisis in 2011. Still early days, the problems in the Eurozone are far from being over.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3789 Posts |
Yea, I don't think anyone, I haven't seen a single one of us say "yea gold and silver are worthless."
The point is, at this time,,,, one shouldn't expect gold and silver to rocket. They have already run up, multi-year highs....
The first post here asked if Cyprus would make a rush into hard assets. Its clear it didn't. Rather, they are caught in a powerful downtrend.
EVEN talk about QE doesn't give it a boost. which.... is another reason that gold and silver are moving lower... the market has already started to discount the QE is going wind down.
Finally... even with all the QE, as I have said, the Fed, the ECB, even the BOJ, they will find a way, a program, to suck that extra money out of the system. So anyone who says this is creating problems,,, is going to be wrong.
Markets run on cycles, rotation of asset classes, everything runs its course. I realize for the vast majority on this forum, the bias IS that PMs are the only way, and should only go up. But markets are saying otherwise. You have to step aside, put your personal opinion aside and grasp that simple concept.
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Valued Member
United States
329 Posts |
"Finally... even with all the QE, as I have said, the Fed, the ECB, even the BOJ, they will find a way, a program, to suck that extra money out of the system."
why would you need a program? Most of the newly pressed cash is filling holes in balance sheets of banks and never enters the system hence the very low velocity of money. The way you remove the liquidity is to sell the bonds into the market like they did in the late 1970's. The problem is we were a net creditor nation back then, so the rising rates killed mostly Latin and Some european banks. We are a net debtor now in a very big way.
Edited by wjl
04/11/2013 7:37 pm
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:
I never said that. Just pointing out that for 5000 years gold and silver have been a store of value, many currencies have come and gone but those coins made of gold and silver have survived and preserved their value. Coin collectors should see that better than anyone else.
Physical metals are held as a hedge against the reckless spending and creation of an unbacked fiat currency by nations. I do not see gold and silver as a get rich quick scheme, if you want that go to a casino or the stock market. It is simply a way to preserve some of your wealth from being inflated away or stolen by bankers and governments. I actually couldnt agree more with that and I apologize if I lumped you in with the turn all your money into PMs crowd. Theres certainly value to PMs and it is wise to have a percentage of money in them. My basic point that has probably gotten lost during the conversation is just that they arent a get rich scheme, nor should you put all your eggs in the PM basket. Whenever it comes to money diversification is always the best course unless you can predict the future |
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Valued Member
United States
329 Posts |
I'm a beleiver in the value of gold but not silver.
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Valued Member
United States
329 Posts |
"Just pointing out that for 5000 years gold and silver have been a store of value, many currencies have come and gone but those coins made of gold and silver have survived and preserved their value."
And for 5000 years silver has been devalued against gold. That said I think people should own some silver, but they should not view it in the same way as gold and should always sell it for gold when its purchasing power in terms of gold is high.
Edited by wjl
04/12/2013 05:00 am
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Pillar of the Community
Japan
666 Posts |
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digital world where value is transferred by bits not the value is being transferred but the rights on that value ... almost the same thing but really different |
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Replies: 162 / Views: 12,389 |
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Posted 04/11/2013 12:05 am
