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RCM Overpricing

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Petersun's Avatar
Canada
1700 Posts
 Posted 02/09/2014  01:41 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petersun to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
And it's also time for the US Mint to flourish. If they have the courage to strike more coins and even raise their prices.
By the way, what happend to Perth Mint?
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Anjohl's Avatar
Canada
815 Posts
 Posted 02/12/2014  02:12 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Anjohl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think the mints products are not for everyone, and their pricing does not affect their core customer base, so people like us on the fringe are of little concern to them. I just bought a 2014 Year of the Horse 2 Pound coin from The Royal Mint for $30, and it DESTROYS any coin I have seen from the RCM from 2006 onwards. The decrease in quality, coupled with the continued gouging on pricing, despite the dropping prices of both precious metals they use is unacceptable. But again, fringe.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
5324 Posts
 Posted 02/12/2014  03:45 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Around a few years ago the Perth Mint took 1992 kooks dies and restrike like 300000 new units into the marketplace, so it destroyed the value of the 92. Most collectors has not forgiven them for restrike coins, the RCM is close to this by the 1\4 oz. war of 1812 gold coin unlimited mint for Goldline, and a nclt proof version at highly inflated price with so call limited mintage.
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Petersun's Avatar
Canada
1700 Posts
 Posted 02/12/2014  10:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petersun to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Is RCM doing this because it is not selling enough?
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Canada
5324 Posts
 Posted 02/12/2014  10:44 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
At least with the 2013 1.5 oz. silver polar bear coin, it was released as an bullion version first, then the RCM just recently released a proof version with an inflated price and limited mintage, also did the same with gold version. I guess we keep buying their products although it seems the last couple of issues a lot of coins are not selling out, and some main dealers are discounting a sure sign sales are slow.
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Libertad's Avatar
Canada
3692 Posts
 Posted 02/12/2014  11:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Libertad to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think they are trying very hard to get kids to collect (rich kids, that is). There's a stark difference between Victorian coins and those dinosaur coins. Even with older NCLT like the .500 silver dollars; they actually resembled a circulating coin. Today they all look like POGs.

I think the whole bullion thing of 2009-2012 was hijacked and taken over by mints realizing the trend. So we got commemorative bullion and art whatevers. Just give me a round disc with the purity, weight, and mintmark punched into it and sell it for a small margin; mint sales might double overnight and they won't get upset collectors.

I think the US Mint is smart in that they play it safe and don't draw on TOO much history or wildlife like Canada does. They have series that extend long periods of times to satisfy some collectors and to establish something that younger collectors can follow up on and catch up. RCM is a bunch of one-offs and messy collections, IMO. It's hard to finish a set and stay interested.
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CC-Ottawa's Avatar
Canada
3690 Posts
 Posted 02/12/2014  11:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CC-Ottawa to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Apparently, they learned a lesson with the 1.5oz polar bear and that is to issue the NCLT first. Witness the devils brigade and the 2014 falcon - NCLT first, and then a bullion coin.

In my view, this is unacceptable and muddies the collector coin market. The RCM just continues to put more and more nails in it's own coffin.
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Canada
5324 Posts
 Posted 02/12/2014  11:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
With the 1/4 oz. gold war of 1812 NCLT coin was released first sold out with a limited mintage of 2000, then the RCM produced a bullion version for goldline which was sold for bullion plus 30.00. In my opinion the NCLT purchasers got hosed but you are correct these bullion replica coins are just creating mass confusion, now you are getting a gold highlined 25 year maple leaf done by a German company that are selling for 500.00 that some people think it' a RCM product, what a mess
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CC-Ottawa's Avatar
Canada
3690 Posts
 Posted 02/12/2014  12:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CC-Ottawa to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yup and now the gilded 25 SMLs are being duplicated. The 525 mintage applies only to the coa and packaging produced by that German company. There are tons more than that of the gilded coins.

That is a good reason why I don't expect PMD products to have any investment value, especially gilded versions of existing RCM coins. The mintage numbers mean nothing.
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Canada
6768 Posts
 Posted 02/12/2014  1:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Silveroid to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply


This is a great example.
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Fixguy's Avatar
Canada
532 Posts
 Posted 02/12/2014  9:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Fixguy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Just give me a round disc with the purity, weight, and mintmark punched into it and sell it for a small margin; mint sales might double overnight and they won't get upset collectors.


Totally agree Libertad. It's just all too flashy for me and I find myself just waiting till it all gets figured out. I'd buy a lot more if it was as you suggest.
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Anjohl's Avatar
Canada
815 Posts
 Posted 02/12/2014  9:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Anjohl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I prefer government backing on my bullion, if possible, or numismatic value, IE, rare denomination J&M vintage bars.
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Libertad's Avatar
Canada
3692 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  12:10 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Libertad to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@Anjohl: Government backing your bullion? How is that possible? If you have it in your hand, then you are the one backing it up. If you're trusting the "5 Dollars" markings then why not just hold polymer dollars? It's the same, right?

I'm assuming you mean government making your bullion, that's different. The dollars markings, as you know, mean absolutely nothing. Collectors don't respect the denominations marked into coins, and the public doesn't recognize them. The last time governments put dollar amounts on gold it all got syphoned out of the hands of people as a safeguard against terrorists (Hitler). Let's just end it there before it gets heated.

In sum, having a government making your bullion can be a good thing, but it's just been fooled with in the last years. These discs didn't exist until the 1980s. They're totally taking advantage of collectors with their proof bullion and commemorative olympic whatevers and overpriced fractionals.
Rest in Peace
Dcadon's Avatar
Canada
1360 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  1:43 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dcadon to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If it was the Olympics, then that was 1973 through 1976. There was a time when silver was way below what it is today, and you could pick up a set of Olympic coins (14 x $5 and 14 x $10 coins) for less then the face value. I keep kicking myself that I didn't take advantage of that. That would have been the start of this Face value - vs - bullion value on coins.

It never made sense to me, as the Americans were scooping up the Canadian silver quarters by the dump-truck full for their melt value. Yet these - more pure Olympic coins were ignored as 'Bullion' for melting.

It wasn't until collectors asked for 'Fine' 99.99% silver instead of sterling, so we could avoid the taxes that are associated with any coins less than pure. (silver or gold) eg: the Early 1912,13,14 golds not being pure were subject to tax, despite being a true legal tender coin. (in it's day, explain that one to me!!) Yet, a 1/25th ounce coin that is never intended to be in circulation, and truly is not of 'bullion value' as it is overprice by at least 4 fold - no tax. (being essentially - jewelry or art)

All of these questions/ suggestions should be addressed so that some semblance of continuity is established. Collector, and Investor - should be on the same page.
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Petersun's Avatar
Canada
1700 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2014  7:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petersun to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here in BC, we still have to pay tax on pure silver/gold products because the HST was dropped.
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