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Replies: 25 / Views: 2,309 |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
697 Posts |
Yes, let's hope to get the specifics from the OP.
In the meantime, the PCGS Price Guide currently has the value of a 1915 Barber Half as $2,000 in MS62, $2,250 in MS62+, and $3,000 in MS63. So if the final grade was one of those three grades, just multiply the appropriate value by 3%. (Perhaps when this process ended the PCGS values may have been different than the current values shown).
If "Regular" grading was chosen by the OP, then the grading fee, on top of the Restoration fee, is $38. If Express was chosen, then the grading fee was $68. PCGS adds on a $10 handling fee per submission form, and naturally there's round trip shipping.
In my opinion, whichever of the above costs were incurred, they're well worth those fees by the improved eye appeal. I'd be very surprised if the OP disagrees.
Hopefully the OP can reply with exact answers.
Steve
Edited by Winesteven 02/17/2022 10:29 pm
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
4692 Posts |
I don't recall the details since this was several years ago. The conserved coin was placed in a no problem holder at the same grade level. I think, but not sure, PCGS either conserved the coin and re-holdered at no fee, or a very low fee. I presented it to them at a show and they were very agreeable. I have since sold the coin because I was concerned the spots may re-appear.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1613 Posts |
First, an absolute beauty and solid example for the grade, possibly a 63. Now this leads to a serious and debated question. Why is this somehow different than one being cleaned? Not knocking this in any way shape or form. But I have seen coins where non-professionals, if you will, achieve the exact results and yet those same professionals return them as cleaned. Why? Conserved, in my opinion, has the same meaning as the word cleaned.
ANA member - PAN Member - BCCS Member There are no problems only solutions - the late, great John Lennon
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
697 Posts |
Quote: First, an absolute beauty and solid example for the grade, possibly a 63. Now this leads to a serious and debated question. Why is this somehow different than one being cleaned? Not knocking this in any way shape or form. But I have seen coins where non-professionals, if you will, achieve the exact results and yet those same professionals return them as cleaned. Why? Conserved, in my opinion, has the same meaning as the word cleaned. I somewhat disagree based on semantics. When professionals restore/conserve a coin, it's generally agreed that it's done to only a certain degree. For example, if "dipped", it's done so gently and quickly that only an extremely minute amount of metal is removed, so that natural brilliant luster can now shine through. When TPG's and other professionals deem a coin has been "Cleaned", they're really saying that whatever treatment has been applied was overdone! For example, cooking sushi grade tuna - it can be seared rare by a knowledgeable chef, or cooked dry, by someone like me. Both are cooked, but the first is to make it real nice and desirable to many, and the latter is deemed by most to have been ruined! Steve
A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine! My collecting "Pride & Joy" is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set: https://www.PCGS.com/setregistry/ty...edset/213996
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Valued Member
 United States
461 Posts |
Cynical here with same reaction as Ballyhoo. Details: cleaned— no $$$ to PCGS. Straight grade conserved: $$$ to PCGS. Maybe a meaningless fact, but still a fact.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
697 Posts |
I truly believe that PCGS and NGC will not play games to make a few extra bucks. By the way, if a collector submits a coin for grading and it's determined to be "Details Cleaned", PCGS still collects the grading fee, so they are getting paid, the same as if that coin submitted for grading gets a straight grade!
A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine! My collecting "Pride & Joy" is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set: https://www.PCGS.com/setregistry/ty...edset/213996
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Valued Member
 United States
461 Posts |
Winesteven My cynical remark referred to paying for restoration, not the grading fee. Why the cynicism? Past grade inflation, which does appear to be a reduced problem. True View photos that don't look like the coin, and exaggerate toning color. I have one of those coins myself. Straight grading "commercially acceptable" cleaned coins, including some just awful Seated dollars. But I am skeptical by nature.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4233 Posts |
I share your cynicism Sharkman. When money is made from a percentage of value, there's incentive. The pricing structure alone is enough to make someone suspicious, as it doesn't cost them any more or less to conserve a coin regardless of it's ultimate grade/value. At least not that I can figure. The coin does look better.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
697 Posts |
I agree with the comment on PCGS True View's which I often call "Not So" True Views, but that's a separate issue.
Regarding PCGS Restoration, I've had a couple of slabbed coins submitted where they determined not to restore, so I was only charged the $10 Evaluation fee. They could have decided to do very minor touch up, kept the slabbed grade the same, and then charge me a new grading fee AND 3% of the value as the Restoration fee, instead of charging me only the $10 Evaluation fee! Why did they do that, when they could have made more money at 3% value fee plus a new grading fee? Maybe they were honest?
Steve
Edited by Winesteven 02/21/2022 11:40 pm
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Valued Member
 United States
461 Posts |
Winesteven Your personal experience is more persuasive than my generalized doubts. I am glad you and the OP had good experiences.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
697 Posts |
I fully agree that not everyone who submits coins to PCGS for Restoration is happy. Sometimes collectors are disappointed that the coin was not accepted for Restoration. Other times collectors are not happy with the job the Restoration team did. Finally, sometimes collectors are unhappy that their coin, after Restoration, was not bumped up at least a "plus" in grade.
Eye appeal is so very subjective. While my personal experiences with Restoration has been very positive, I also sense from participating on various forums over the last few years that overall collectors are surprisingly pleased with the results. As such, I take it upon myself to share my experiences with others on forums that have not given it a try, often due to misperceptions. "Education" is good for all of us.
Steve
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4233 Posts |
I guess I don't understand their pricing model (which leads to my cynicism). Does a $10,000 coin get the super-duper $300 restoration while the $1000 coin gets the $30 el cheapo special? Seems like the process would be the same regardless - a silver coin is a silver coin. ANACS charges a flat $39 for up to 20 coins. People have been doing this for many decades and I'm not sure if any service has a special sauce that the others don't have. But since I've never done it myself I should probably butt out.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
697 Posts |
You're correct regarding the pricing model based on a % of value. Unfortunately on life, right or wrong, this concept applies. Financial professionals often charge a % of assets under management, and while the % is often slightly lower for larger accounts, an account of $2,000,000 may pay an annual fee of $15,000, where a $500,000 account may pay a fee of about $6,000. In my opinion, that larger account is not taking 2.5 times the time of the smaller account. Same thing for Realtors selling houses, and Attorneys charging fees for handling estates. Maybe it's not right, but it is the way it is.
To take advantage of that fee structure, submit coins for Restoration of lower value in lieu of having more expensive coins submitted!!!!
Edited by Winesteven 02/23/2022 06:51 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1173 Posts |
Excellent topic with lots of interesting responses!
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Valued Member
United States
202 Posts |
If submitting a coin for restoration that is in a PCGS holder, they guarantee that the coin will not downgrade. What if upon cracking the coin out they notice that PVC or corrosion has eaten away into the surface of the coin beyond conservation? It could be in a spot along the edge that isn't visible in an older holder. I wonder if they would pay out a guarantee on the coin even though the guarantee states:
The PCGS Guarantee does not apply to coins exhibiting environmental deterioration subsequent to PCGS grading and encapsulation. This deterioration may include, but is not limited to, spotting, hazing, PVC contamination, changes in color, and corrosion.
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