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 Replies: 35 / Views: 4,211 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1812 Posts |
Didn't Boggs get arrested for counterfieting, even though his art looked nothing like the genuine currency, but the fact that he was trying to spend it at his face value placed on the notes... What most of the public didn't know back then, was that there was a collector base for his currency art and worth more then what he was trying to purchase the items for...
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:Here's another metaphor: Say someone sells kits to build replicas of classic cars as (at least here in NJ) there is a rather large number of classic car enthusiasts who can't afford the real thing, but appreciate the aesthetic and the history. Is the seller of these kits responsible if someone buys one, builds the car, and then tries to hawk it on ebay Motors as an original? Yet another metaphor: Is the manufacturer of a replica of a vintage Colt .45 revolver to be held responsible if someone holds up a bank with their product? The big difference is making currency is illegal, replica cars are not. Plus the question isn't really what happens with the product afterwards like the Colt and car metaphors but whether or not it should be allowed to exist at all. At the very least if he either chose to or was forced to stamp "Not Legal Tender" into the design it would eliminate a lot of if not all of the controversy |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1227 Posts |
Here is the issue I see with your analogy, person-from-page-one-whose-name-I-forgot-to-catch (sorry). What you are describing is a fraudulent PRODUCT--you can get in trouble for selling a "real" (actually replica) car, because that's intent to defraud by deception. You cannot, however, get in trouble for driving a replica car and calling it real.
You can, however, get in lots of trouble for spending a fake coin--even if you weren't the maker. And even if you didn't know it was fake, you can get into all kinds of legal unpleasantness before they sort that out. One of these has ramifications for the receiver far beyond being gypped. It's not the replica car.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1903 Posts |
The reason I think the government would get in a tizzy over something like this is that they want the monopoly on making worthless pieces of currency! Lol
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Forum Mom
 United States
5877 Posts |
I've read all of the posts in this topic and I think the real analogy is: How is this different from the Chinese "art" coins? I have to agree with Bryan and the others who feel that this is deceptive to the uneducated. I feel this promotes a gray area of numismatics that I find distasteful.
For the record, I see hobo nickels as simply altered coins with no added value.
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:
Didn't Boggs get arrested for counterfieting Once in England and once in Australia in the 80s. The US Secret Service has some of his notes and have taken his stuff in the past but no charges yet probably because they arent sure of a conviction. But I'm pretty sure hes wanted right now. In 06 he was arrested for meth, drug paraphernalia and illegally carrying a concealed weapon and then never showed up for court. At least thats the last I heard not sure if anyone has any updates about that or really cares lol |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1903 Posts |
He has succefully dodged arrest in regards to his notes here in the U.S. because he "barters" them and does not try to pass them off as real money. There was a TV documentary done on him on 60 Minutes many years ago. He is very intentional in his "transaction" as he calls it to be sure the party is aware it isn't a real note...but also neglects to tell them who he is until after they agree to the barter. Once they have he then signs the back of the note ( which are blank ) and lists what he bought and fingerprints it...once this is done he notifies his collector community where he used the "note" of which a deluge of calls usually come in trying to buy it. The piece I saw was done in the 90s and back then a $100 face note of his would regularly sell for $2500 on the collector market if properly authenticated.
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Locked
822 Posts |
What makes me want to vomit even more than the fact he makes this garbage, is that some TPGs certify this crap. Look here and here. Hope no PNG members sell this stuff as it all falls right into their new definition of coin doctoring... Quote:
Movement, addition to, or otherwise altering of metal, so that a coin appears to be in a better state of preservation, or more valuable than it otherwise would be. Edited by scubu
10/03/2012 11:42 am
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Moderator
United States
188560 Posts |
Quote: It is also the 1964 Peace dollar and others that were actually minted by the US at one time but supposedly all destroyed that really started the distaste in my mouth for this practice. This is the one that really bothers me and we have had lengthy discussions on it before. While I am generally indifferent towards all of the other fantasy pieces, each "new release" makes me a bit more uncomfortable with the whole idea. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
613 Posts |
How is this different from chinese counterfeits, other than the counterfeiter is upfront about it?
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12437 Posts |
Daniel Carr was once a member of the US Mint's Artistic Infusion Program and was the designer of the New York and Rhode Island State Quarters. During his participation in the AIP, he also created preliminary designs for several other State Quarters, this Maryland design was most likely one of them. |
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Valued Member
291 Posts |
I always thought Carr was walking a fine line, legally speaking.
But I'm not a lawyer, so I can't say for sure.
I do see the potential for fraud farther down the road after the coins leave his "mint", however.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1770 Posts |
if he sells these as "original art pieces" then I dont have a problem with it, but make sure it doesn't fool anyone into thinking these are anything but artistic fantasies
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
14454 Posts |
I want to apologize for even bringing this up as I know there are allot of strong feelings both ways. Some feel; just as strong for it as I am against it. I really worry about what will happen in the future when they are out of their 2x2 with the insert explaining what they are and the unsuspecting new collector is willing to pay whatever it takes to own a overstruck coin like the Morgans and others he is minting thinking they came from the US Mint. I just feel it is a great disservice to the collecting community as a whole for future generations and that is what we all are is caretakers of the coins we collect for future generations to enjoy as we have. I also fear he is going to keep jumping through that loophole he is working through and is going to get caught in it one day as I feel he has really crossed the line more than once and has just been lucky Quote:
Daniel Carr was once a member of the US Mint's Artistic Infusion Program and was the designer of the New York and Rhode Island State Quarters In my original post I stated when he started he was designing coins for the Mint |
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:
I want to apologize for even bringing this up as I know there are allot of strong feelings both ways. No need to apologize a healthy debate or exchange of ideas is a good thing.  As this thread has showed its possible to disagree and still remain civil |
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Replies: 35 / Views: 4,211 |
First Page
Posted 10/03/2012 03:00 am
