At What Grade Is Value Unaffected By A Coin Being "Cleaned"?

Anything that's low enough grade that you can no longer tell whether it was cleaned or not, or it's only bullion value anyway. Even with rare coins you'll get taken to the cleaners if it's been cleaned...

I say it has to be something so common that you can get an AU close too the price of bullion. Such as like a Franklin half dollar or a late Washington quarter. The one I see it a lot is with Walking Liberty half dollars. No matter what the coin is you will pretty much reduce the value a lot unless it's value is close to its metal value.

Cleaning is usually a term for polishing a coin to get rid of toning. Whizzing etc.

No one would see a dip in acetone as cleaning since it's just getting the junk off leaving the toning and metal alone.

Dipping is something extremely specific. You would only a dip a mint state coin to strip toning. It's conterversal and can ruin a coin too due it risks.

A small cleaning that is a great deal ago will go unnoticed. Polishing a coin will forever mar it's surfaces.

Another interesting thread.

After reading it, and seeing it was started in the Canada
section, I wonder if thoughts on cleaned coins are different
in different countries.

For me, cleaned, scratched, bent or damaged coins should sell
for less than a problem free coin of the same grade.

Depending how severe the cleaning, or damage, is will have
a different impact on the price.

I don't mind buying some problem coins, as long as the price
is low enough.

But if I have a choice of a cleaned/problem coin and a coin
that is one grade less with no problem, that are close to
the same price. I will pick the problem free coin.

Thanks for all the interesting answers everyone!
I typically try to avoid problem coins, but if I run into a situation where because of rarity or affordability, it's my only option, I may have to look back on this thread to make my decision on what I am willing to pay for such a coin.




Sap, you bring up good point.

I understand that with the catalogs and price guides not being able to keep up with the daily fluctuations in the spot price of the bullion in question, this "bullion grade" does fluctuate, and in some cases, enough to move some coins in and out of this category, but why is that. Certainly if there is a numismatic premium on a coin at any given spot price for the bullion in question, the same premium should apply if the spot price increases (or decreases). Why should numismatic prices not fluctuate with the spot price of the bullion in question?

I'm pretty new to collecting and I have made my share of mistakes. Here's one that I'd like to share in the hopes that it will prevent someone else from making the same mistake.
I purchased a Canadian silver dollar (I think it was a 52). It was pretty much perfect in my eyes, proof like. Here's where I went wrong. It had a finger print or two and with great care I wiped it down with one of those little clothes you would get when you get a new pair of glasses. (very very gentle).

I had an opportunity to bring it to a local coin show. A couple of guys had a look. Told me I had a great coin and too bad it had been wiped (cleaned).

Logically, this should indeed be true and logically, I agree with you - every coin should have "bullion value" and "numismatic premium" components of its total value and these two halves of the total value should go up and down independent from each other, with the respective markets in question. The demonstrable fact is, that they do not. The reason behind this is to be found in in human nature rather than in as a property of the coins themselves, because humans as a whole are (a) illogical, and (b) lazy.

Coin collectors simply don't want to pay extra for their coins, just because some silver pundits trading paper-silver reckon they theoretically should. So in a precious metal price spike, the total price of collector coins does not rise anywhere near as rapidly as the silver price does. So, in effect, when the price of bullion goes up, the numismatic premiums on collectable coins go down - because there are fewer and fewer collectors to be found willing to pay that premium, on top of the increasing silver price. And so, as numismatic premiums shrink to zero, more and more once-collectable coins get tossed into the scrap heap - literally, sometimes.

Fortunately, most dealers won't instantly dump something into the junk bin just because of a spike in precious metals. PL/MS 10 and 25 cents from the early 60s are next to impossible to sell at much of a premium. That being said, I've hoarded a fair bit, when in the future, it will be worth more than the melt value. Of course, I'm sure every other dealer does the same thing. We're all waiting for the numismatic value to go up, but none of us want to blink and melt the stuff to make that happen!