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 Replies: 39 / Views: 4,838 |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
The link is a good read, but most everything he is discussing and illustrating are modern fakes not contemporary counterfeits.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
7390 Posts |
Ya, I got that when I reread it after I posted it. That title was misleading but that Ellis Island was a dead giveaway.
Conder, are we still thinking contemporary silver counterfit? I assume you stand by your fitst post. If this were yours what would your next step be? This thing will fool collectors let alone the general public.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
9796 Posts |
What's the weight? To a tenth of a gram if possible.
"Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin" - Aaron R. Feldman - "And read it" - Me 2013! ANA Life Member #3288 in good standing since 1981, ANS, Early American Coppers Member (EAC), Colonial Coin Collectors Club member (C4), Conder Token Collector Club member (CTCC), Civil War Token Society (CWTS) member, Liberty Seated Collectors Club (LSCC) & Numismatic Bibliomania Society member (NBS), USMex, Member in good standing, 2¢ variety collector. See my want page: http://goccf.com/t/140440 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7390 Posts |
Here you go westcoin... read Conder101's first post too Can't wait what to see what you think as I respect your opinion  I wonder why this isn't as hot a topic as it should be? And I also wonder where Steve is, maybe he didn't get my email? I'd of thought he'd be all over this  Edited by Cascade
07/07/2015 7:05 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1512 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7390 Posts |
Edited by Cascade
07/08/2015 10:32 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
9796 Posts |
Yep the weight is a bit low even with that much wear. The damage and wear does not seem to be enough to remove .7 grams. The lettering is quite mushy, again hard to tell if it was that way from a counterfeit die or just wear/damage. The design overall isn't too bad looking - meaning nothing to out positively that it's fake. The rims look correct as does the edge reeding.
We do know there have been some pretty darn good counterfeits made, the micro O dollars even were being slabbed by PCGS, NGC and ANACS turned out to be fakes.
"Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin" - Aaron R. Feldman - "And read it" - Me 2013! ANA Life Member #3288 in good standing since 1981, ANS, Early American Coppers Member (EAC), Colonial Coin Collectors Club member (C4), Conder Token Collector Club member (CTCC), Civil War Token Society (CWTS) member, Liberty Seated Collectors Club (LSCC) & Numismatic Bibliomania Society member (NBS), USMex, Member in good standing, 2¢ variety collector. See my want page: http://goccf.com/t/140440 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4421 Posts |
Here's a somewhat similar looking Morgan that weighs 20.0 grams:   Note the somewhat rounded letters, numerals and stars. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7390 Posts |
Westcoin how would wear be so random plus how would it totally abolish the top arrowhead? I think these factors preclude natural wear don't you?
Exo, as "bad" as that one is it is more sharp looking than mine if that makes sense. I wonder what the reeding looks like on that one... However I also now have the urge stamp mine "Thad" lol
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4421 Posts |
Cascade ... The reeding looks more convincing than that on the OP's piece. This one's over 20% underweight. The seemingly rounded features are similar to that on the OP's piece, methinks.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7390 Posts |
Exo, I am the op lol. And yes, there are similarities but just as many differances in the overall features as well. Like the obverse lettering for one. My letters look very realistic and on that one they're a dead giveaway
Edited by Cascade
07/08/2015 10:02 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4421 Posts |
Quote:
Exo, I am the op lol. Forgot ... I'm gettin' more old by the day, the thread ...  Looking at your close-ups, Cascade, I see a similar looking, rounding effect with the letters, etc. It looks to me like they were inflated. Need I visit the eye doctor?  I suspect that mine didn't circulate as much; this, given its low weight of 20.0 grams. In addition to the BAD c/s, it was hole-cancelled, like early paper scrip that had been withdrawn from circulation. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4409 Posts |
The more I look at this, the one thing that keeps popping out at me is the edge.
Notice in the second photo showing the edge (with the obverse facing upward) how there appears to be a hole/inlet in the reeding. The hole is also noticeable in the comparison picture showing the edges horizontally.
To my eye, that spot/hole/inlet looks deeper than a mere bump or ding to the edge.
-MV
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Pillar of the Community
United States
9796 Posts |
I think any uneven wear is from PMD done on purpose, or it was struck with a counterfeit die, that could explain the unevenness overall, the die may not have been as hard as it needs to be nor would a counterfeit be struck with anywhere near the same tonnage that Morgan dollars are struck at around 150 tons per square inch. "Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin" - Aaron R. Feldman - "And read it" - Me 2013! ANA Life Member #3288 in good standing since 1981, ANS, Early American Coppers Member (EAC), Colonial Coin Collectors Club member (C4), Conder Token Collector Club member (CTCC), Civil War Token Society (CWTS) member, Liberty Seated Collectors Club (LSCC) & Numismatic Bibliomania Society member (NBS), USMex, Member in good standing, 2¢ variety collector. See my want page: http://goccf.com/t/140440Edited by westcoin
07/09/2015 11:05 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7390 Posts |
Thanks for your input west & medow, Mike diamond took a look at it and he also agrees that contemporary counterfit is a possibility that should be looked into. My new mission is to get this into the right hands for proper evaluation.
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Replies: 39 / Views: 4,838 |
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Posted 07/06/2015 11:02 pm
