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Shekel Of Tyre (Year 162, Kp Mint)

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 Posted 03/13/2016  11:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobstam to your friends list
Thank you echizento, I was looking for this coin for over a year (at the right price).
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 Posted 03/14/2016  09:17 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add lrbguy to your friends list
Something about this coin troubles me a tad (but not its authenticity).

Does the reverse side of the slab give its weight? Could we see the flip side of the whole slab?

[Aside: Ron, your coin is a Late Seleucid tetradrachm minted at Tyre, but you aren't suggesting it is a shekel of Tyre, are you? There is a rather fundamental reason it is not. Do we need to discuss that?]
Edited by lrbguy
03/14/2016 09:24 am
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 Posted 03/14/2016  09:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list
No, I realize mine isn't a Shekel of Tyre. A bit early for that, but the reverse designs are similar. Feel free to enlighten us with the difference though.
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 Posted 03/14/2016  10:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobstam to your friends list
lrbguy:

Please, see below the reverse of the slab. Usually the weight of this coin would be on obverse side of the slab.I would like to know the weight too.The corner is chipped, however the slab is tight closed.

The obverse of this shekel looks like mine and I think has the same year ("PEB" - 162)
Please, change "PCGS" to not capital letters in the link below
http://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...GS-497961243

Interesting that they were slabbed for New York Mint (?):

http://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...e-1693581985

PCGS doesn't grade ancient coins. I'm curious what would be the grade if NGC would grade my coin.

Shekel-Of-Tyre-Year-162,-Kp-Mint

Shekel-Of-Tyre-Year-162,-Kp-Mint
Edited by bobstam
03/14/2016 11:38 am
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 Posted 03/14/2016  3:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add lrbguy to your friends list
Large silvers from the mint at Tyre were identified as Hellenistic Greek tetradrachms whether produced under the Ptolemies or the Seleucids. However, with the decline of Demetrius II, who died 125BC, Tyre became autonomous. Its mint continued production of high grade silver coins (94%), in full and half denominations, dated by the civic year starting at "1" with the year autonomy commenced (apparently half way through the second year of Demetrius II (127/6). The OP coin in this thread is dated to year 162, which corresponds to year 43 AD.

Because of the quality of the silver in their tetradrachms, merchants and the priesthood in Jerusalem, which did not have the resources or autonomy for production of its own silver coins, were particularly attracted to the silver of Tyre, and adopted their tetradrachm for its preferred shekel for Temple transactions. The Tyrian didrachm was the only form of half shekel coin acceptable for payment of the half shekel temple tax. Coins specially minted for Jerusalem carry the "KP" monogram in the upper field just right of the eagle. It is by virtue of the connection to Jerusalem that these Tyrian tetradrachmae (as the Greeks still called them) came to be called Shekels of Tyre.

If the weight of the OP coin is in the range of 13 gm or more it is certainly a shekel. The half shekel weighs 6.5-7.2 gm or so. The reduced flan size on this coin makes me wonder if it might actually be a Jerusalem half shekel. More of the smaller unit have survived from the later range of production of the type, when this coin was struck. This is why I recommend that if you seriously intend to resubmit the coin, you would do well to crack it out before submitting and get an accurate weight on this coin and a direct measurement of its diameter. While you have it in its "raw" state, let me suggest that you also get photographs of it with a variety of angles of lighting on both sides. This will give you a good record that will be hard to do once it is encapsulated. At the very least, ask NGC to record weight and size of the coin.

Finally, if the weight of this coin is not in either of the proper ranges for the shekel or its half, then in view of the crack and the missing weight info you may need to question the originality of the slab. My hope is that this coin is in fact a shekel on a thick "dumpy" flan.
Edited by lrbguy
03/14/2016 3:20 pm
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 Posted 03/14/2016  10:26 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add oh my florin to your friends list
I am thinking fake because PCGS doesn't grade ancients (slab perhaps) anyone else want to comment on that?
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 Posted 03/14/2016  10:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list
PCGS # 134327204 comes back to a Shekel dated 126 BC-55 AD, and graded genuine 89 BU.
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 Posted 03/15/2016  12:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobstam to your friends list
lrbguy:

The year 162 on the coin corresponds to 36/7 AD.

I estimated weight of the coin. I weighted same 24mm PCGS slab with coin in it, subtracted weight of the coin and got the slab weight. Then I weighted the slab with shekel and subtracted the weight of the slab.

The other coin weight is 5.37 grams (according to the NGC online catalog, the coin is in MS)
I got weight of empty PCGS slab, it's 30.7 grams.

44.54gr-30.7gr= 13.84gr

I would estimate the weight of the broken corner, assuming the weight of the slab is 30.7 grams, is should not be less then 0.3-0.4 grams.

So, the weight of the shekel is 13.84gr+0.35gr=14.19gr (of course it's "about")

Eventually I will submit the coin to NGC for grading (and thicker holder). I will definitely follow advise of Irbguy.
Will see how accurate my estimations were.

Shekel-Of-Tyre-Year-162,-Kp-Mint

Shekel-Of-Tyre-Year-162,-Kp-Mint
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 Posted 03/15/2016  3:10 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add lrbguy to your friends list
That sounds like a workable procedure, and I am relieved to hear that your coin's weight is in range for a full shekel. Your plan to resubmit is a good one, especially in view of the corner, and I am sure that will all turn out well. Please do post images when the coin is "between" slabs.

Congratulations on getting a nice piece and at a good price!
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 Posted 03/15/2016  9:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list
Just received this link in an e-mail from Moneta-L. It's a PDF on Tyre Shekels, you might find it interesting.

http://www.cNGCoins.com/Photos/Publ...ent_2014.pdf
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 Posted 03/16/2016  10:24 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add lrbguy to your friends list
What an outstanding piece of work that is. Thank you for the link to the PDF, Ron. This one is worth holding on to.

Is this publication series something that is routinely sent to you?

[Ah, just noticed it came from Moneta-L. I should check my digest from them.]
Edited by lrbguy
03/16/2016 10:25 am
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 Posted 03/16/2016  1:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list
Every once in a while they put out something. An excellent group to be a member of.
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 Posted 03/17/2016  11:27 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobstam to your friends list
Thank you Irbguy, will post the pictures of the "raw" coin soon.

echizento: thank you for the link, very interesting information about Tyre Shekels.
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 Posted 03/17/2016  12:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list
Very nice coin bobstam and congrats on the purchase. I'm not sure we ever heard the reason for the damage to the slab. Did it come that way from the seller or maybe your wife discovered how much you are spending on coins and decided to let you have it?
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb

"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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 Posted 03/18/2016  10:13 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobstam to your friends list
Thank you spence!
The coin came with the broken corner already, probably the wife of the previous owner discovered the cost of the coin :-) My wife was just happy about my purchase, she got nice credit line from the family budget (I did not include it in the price of the coin)

If a problem can be solved by money, it's not a problem, it's an expense
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