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Pillar of the Community
Czech Republic
803 Posts |
Welcome to the awesome and rewarding world of 8 Reales collecting! Buy the books, learn the diagnostics, visit coin shows and join forums (here, PCGS, NGC (not a very active forum)) and chat with dealers and fellow collectors. I really like these and have decided to work on a date/assayer/variety run from Mexico City Mint. Specifically around Carlos IIII (1791) to Ferdinand VII (1821). Registry could be a good guide, as it would force you to get better at authenticating or you would be wasting money submitting them to TPGs. Figure out what you like - is it the certain look and feel of the set? the grade? particular design? Lots of options. Here's what I've been working on for the last decade or so: Carlos IIII: https://www.PCGS.com/SetRegistry/me...imeset/98849Ferdinand VII Armored Bust: https://www.PCGS.com/SetRegistry/me...imeset/98851Ferdinand VII Draped Bust: https://www.PCGS.com/SetRegistry/me...imeset/98850Feel free to drop me a note here or at PCGS if you want to chat more. Edited by TwoKopeiki
04/20/2017 1:18 pm
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Pillar of the Community
 United Kingdom
1273 Posts |
Thanks for the replies! I've just ordered Bob's book on Counterfeit Portrait Eight Reales and I can't wait to read and study. TwoKopeiki, Those coins in those registry sets are beautiful, some of the high grades are astounding. To have lasted so long and remained so fine. Just looking at your date run of Charles IV and I'm loving it. Silly question perhaps but I've not come across this registry before on PCGS. Have all these Reales of yours been slabbed, and you can create a registry of it online like you have? I'm assuming so, as they have PCGS numbers? That 1803 MS63 is absolutely beautiful, how on earth did you find that? Quote:
Registry could be a good guide, as it would force you to get better at authenticating or you would be wasting money submitting them to TPGs. Sorry but I'm unsure what you mean, do you mean I should buy them already certified by TPG, or look at pre-existing registry sets such as yours to learn what is authentic? You're really making me want to do a date run eventually...but to get really great grades...that's the challenge. I like the one I bought because of the British counterstamp and its history, and it would be great to have a British counterstamp set of Eight Reales, they seem quite hard to find, making the hunt all the more exciting. JPL - Thanks for the info, I'll take a look at those firms that you mentioned. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1801 Posts |
TobyJ Parroting TwoKopeiki, welcome to the wonderful world of 8 Reales. I grew up collecting US coins, like every other kid on my street but saw a full date run display of Mexico Mint Pillar Dollars 1732-1771 at a coin show one day when I was 20 and that started me on this crazy collecting path. Now 42 years later I am still addicted and have loved every minute of the journey. If you want to collect a date set, I say go for it. If you want a type set of monarchs or assayers or mints of styles or whatever strikes your fancy, go for it. But do buy the Gurney Book, do talk to other collectors, do look at every 8 reales coin you come across. Learn how to spot "problem" coins so you can avoid them. Buy from reputable dealers as Colonial John pointed out. I would even go so far as to suggest only buy coins in hand, not over the internet until your confidence level is strong. Join USMexNA and start getting their quarterly journal. If you can make it to one of their October conventions, go. The educational seminars warrant the cost. In my 40+ years of collecting 8's I have been burned by fakes, bought bad coins I should have passed on and endured some disappointments, but I have also acquired some beautiful coins, met some amazing people, developed some old and "beginning" friendships with fellow collectors and assembled a collection that brings me great joy. Best of all, the collection is what I like. Plan out your collection to do that for you whatever/however you choose. Most all of my coins were acquired raw but in the last few years, encouraged by TwoKopeiki and a few others I have sent in certain segments of my collection to be slabbed and have started buying some coins already in TPG slabs. I have three registry sets under the name "RFS Industries", I started them as a way to share some of my coins with fellow collectors. https://coins.www.collectors-societ...SetID=195898https://www.PCGS.com/setregistry/alltimeset/122362https://www.PCGS.com/SetRegistry/me...meset/118162 |
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Pillar of the Community
Czech Republic
803 Posts |
Quote:
Those coins in those registry sets are beautiful, some of the high grades are astounding. To have lasted so long and remained so fine. Just looking at your date run of Charles IV and I'm loving it.
Thanks, Toby. You should check out jfransch's sets posted - he's one of my inspirations :) Quote:
Silly question perhaps but I've not come across this registry before on PCGS. Have all these Reales of yours been slabbed, and you can create a registry of it online like you have? I'm assuming so, as they have PCGS numbers? That 1803 MS63 is absolutely beautiful, how on earth did you find that? All of the ones in the set are slabbed by PCGS. I can get distracted easily and early on realized that if I wanted to have a nice set, I needed to focus. Registry gave me that focus. Back in 2005 NGC or PCGS didn't have a robust set of Mexico Mint registries, so I worked with them to create the basic sets. I still get distracted, but not as often ;) In terms of where to get coins like the ones in my set - develop your network of dealers and collectors. Once folks know what you collect, they can give you heads-up if something that fits your collection comes-up for sale. I don't overly rely on others, though, and have a robust set of websites and search alerts that helps me be on top of things when something new comes-up. If you want to build a world-class set, however, you have to make sure you are on specialized dealer's lists when new coins or collections come up for sale. Quote:Sorry but I'm unsure what you mean, do you mean I should buy them already certified by TPG, or look at pre-existing registry sets such as yours to learn what is authentic? All I meant is that this area is highly counterfeited and until you can learn to distinguish all the different red flags, buying graded coins can give you a level of comfort. With time, as you handle more and more raw examples, you'll be able to actually tell if the weight is off by a few grams just by picking it up. Good luck! And make sure you share your journey with the members here. It's nice to live vicariously through posts and photos!! :) |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1156 Posts |
@jfransch, how does your grading experience with NGC compare to PCGS? And which one will get your Charles III business?
@TwoKopeiki, great advice!
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1801 Posts |
Jgenn I received mixed advice on which TPG to use when I decided to slab some of the coins, so I sent the Ferds to PCGS and the Carlos IIII to NGC. I have not been 100% happy with either but learning how they work and how they see things has helped. I have all the remaining Carlos IIII coins for the set except a couple over-dates/over-assayers but have been putting off sending them in because I have been too busy at work. My Carlos III if I decide to slab will go to NGC. I find them a bit more realistic in terms of strike issues vs wear issues and a bit more consistent in terms of "I send in an MS coin, I get an MS grade". I have several Ferdinand in the PCGS sets that by my eye have no wear, just soft strikes which are very common in that series but came back AU 55 or 58. Your Carlos III set is awesome,(what? no 78 FM?..LOL) how long have you been collecting those? Does your pillar run only include Carlos III and only Mo mint? Do you belong to USMexNA and do you attend the October show? I would enjoy meeting and putting a face to the jgenn moniker. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1316 Posts |
I am up to six 8 Reales. I collect coins dated to the '82s, and my 1782 Carolus III are some of my favorite in my collection that spans coins of many countries, types, and centuries.
I have three chopmarked Mexicos, El Cazador coins from Peru and Mexico, and a Boliva repunched date. Eventually I want all of the mints for the year, but Chile and Guatemala likely won't be happening anytime soon due to infrequent listings and lack of that kind of money.
I also have an 1882 with pretty toning, but not sure if the Cap & Rays are the focus of your post.
6/8 are in slabs. Two of the chop marked are well worn and not worth it.
Edited by Collects82
04/22/2017 7:16 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
1273 Posts |
Thanks for all the replies.
So much information to absorb. My copy of Counterfeit Portrait Eight-Reales just arrived, so I'll be reading and absorbing it all.
I'm visiting Spain in a few weeks, and I've already scouted out a few Numismatic shops that sell Spanish Colonial coinage. My girlfriend is fluent in Spanish, which makes it a lot easier for me. I hope to find some good-looking Reales and I'll be sure to post them up.
Collects82: I'll look out for those 1782 Chile and Guatemala! You never know, I may just find one in Spain.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1801 Posts |
TobyJ
There is an outdoor coin show every Sunday in the Plaza Mayor in the center of Madrid. But be aware, I saw 2-3 fakes for every legitimate Colonial 8 Reales when I was there. Also the show was heavy on Euro coins and light on Colonial coins. Madrid is fun, try and go to the palace there and check out the collection of armor and weapons. It is fantastic.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1156 Posts |
jfransch, I built my collection over the last seven years. I started with an El Cazador piece, and, like the OP, got it into my head that I could collect 8 reales by year. I just have a type collection of 8 reales from other mints and monarchs.
I've been meaning to join the US-Mexican Numismatic Association and I hope to attend the annual convention one day. I would enjoy meeting you and will let you know if I'll be there in October.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3343 Posts |
Go for the cobs! They're baaaaaaaaad!  Real piratey. "Two minutes ago I would have sold my chances for a tired dime." Fred Astaire
Edited by thq
04/23/2017 9:08 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
1273 Posts |
jfransch:
I'll try to get to Madrid in June when I go back. I'm in Malaga next week, and I noticed a few Numismatic shops that may have some interesting coins. I've been reading The Counterfeit Eight-Reales Book, and it is very interesting indeed. No wonder so many Contemporary Counterfeits were made. I was confused initially, as reading through forums it seemed that a lot of contemporary counterfeits had high silver content. But, if the Chinese were buying them at 15% above bullion value, it makes perfect sense to me now.
Thq:
The cobs are real piratey haha, but I've got to focus on one thing first really! Maybe one day I'll look into some cobs.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1949 Posts |
Quote:
TobyJ
There is an outdoor coin show every Sunday in the Plaza Mayor in the center of Madrid. But be aware, I saw 2-3 fakes for every legitimate Colonial 8 Reales when I was there. Also the show was heavy on Euro coins and light on Colonial coins. Madrid is fun, try and go to the palace there and check out the collection of armor and weapons. It is fantastic. Even if you are not at Plaza Mayor on a Sunday, there are several coin shops in the Plaza, as well in the surrounding area... Keep in mind there is very little English spoken, and even though my wife can speak Spanish quite well, it was still difficult to communicate with some of the vendors... The shop in the far left hand corner of the plaza had a massive amount of Colonial pieces this past autumn but did not have them on display, you had to ask... I have not made it to Malaga, but if you make it to Barcelona at some point be extremely cautious with numismatic purchases, when I was there this past autumn, I saw some of the most convincing modern counterfeits I have seen, especially of British Commonwealth... |
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Valued Member
Spain
108 Posts |
TobyJ, in Malaga you can try Numismatica Gonzalo Gonzalez (it is near the cathedral) he is specialized in ancient Malaka coins, but perhaps you can find what you are looking for, so several years ago I bought him an acceptable 8 reales.
Enjoy in Malaga
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
1273 Posts |
Jdmern: I'll watch out in Barcelona if I go there again, thanks for the tips.
Veton: That is the shop I was going to! It looks very good, I'm looking forward to going and looking, even if I don't end up buying much.
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Replies: 20 / Views: 5,891 |
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Posted 04/20/2017 4:09 pm
