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The Offical PCGS Big One™ Announced

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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2010  4:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list
From their website

" Initially, PCGS Secure Plus will be offered for Walkthrough, Express and Gold Express service levels for raw coins, regrades and reholders."

Note the word "initially". To me that means that it will eventually be expanded to cover more levels.

What get me is they have had this capability for 19 years.

So we have a longer barcode, half point grading for most MS coins (done by various TPGs since 1984), and digital fingerprinting (Done by PCGS and Compugrade back in 1991) Since there is nothing here less than 15 years old, hardly something to "revolutionize" the industry.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2010  4:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bryan1315 to your friends list
I agree this "plus" thing is just trying to take a stab at CAC so to speak. The rest will never work unless they do it to every coin. If they do it to every coin they will hurt their own business as well because I ma sure they make quite a bit on the crack out game and this will eliminate this practice
Pillar of the Community
United States
1523 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2010  4:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Halfwitty to your friends list
I can understand that there is a concern about someone cracking a coin out,artificially toning it and so on but isn't that what the grader is supposed to be able to determine?I really see nothing here that is going to help the collector.I see nothing at all wrong with resubmitting a coin if you feel the person who graded it wasn't on the ball that day,had a fight with their spouse,hangover,whatever.The company should welcome that practice in my opinion.I believe this is just a ploy to allow slabbing prices to increase by giving the customer some false sense of security and increased value for the service and I agree with Bryan that the security is false unless every coin is mapped.
Pillar of the Community
United States
1534 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2010  4:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wheatguy to your friends list
But if you want the SecurePlus service, the coin will be scanned, and so if someone resubmits it, they will know if the coin has changed from when they previously graded it.
Pillar of the Community
United States
1523 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2010  5:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Halfwitty to your friends list
I understand that aspect but isn't a professional grader with these big TPG's able to tell by studying the coin if it has been altered in any way?
Pillar of the Community
United States
1534 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2010  5:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wheatguy to your friends list
It's difficult, and problem or doctored coins can occasionally slip by.
Pillar of the Community
United States
1882 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2010  6:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add steve199 to your friends list

Quote:
But if you want the SecurePlus service, the coin will be scanned, and so if someone resubmits it, they will know if the coin has changed from when they previously graded it.


Except for the case of theft, how does that provide any added value for the original submitter of the coin?
Bedrock of the Community
United States
10982 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2010  9:04 pm  Show Profile   Check BH1964's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add BH1964 to your friends list

Quote:
...they will hurt their own business as well because I'm sure they make quite a bit on the crack out game and this will eliminate this practice...



That's what I was thinking. Surely they have some idea of the number of crack-out resubmissions they get, but maybe not.

This didn't turn out to be any big change that was hyped up for weeks and maybe that's a good thing!

ANA #R3154474
Pillar of the Community
United States
1523 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2010  9:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Halfwitty to your friends list
At least it wasn't the 100 point grading system.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts
 Posted 03/26/2010  04:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bryan1315 to your friends list
I don't understand why a person wants to be sure a coin they submit doesn't get upgraded sometime down the road for someone else. The theft thing would be a good thing because if the coin was cracked out and resubmitted they would know who submitted it first but would they call each of those people to see if the current owner is supposed to have it?
Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts
 Posted 03/26/2010  1:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list
It would allow the person that it was stolen from to send a list of the stolen coins to PCGS. Then if one of the stolen coins was cracked out and resubmitted the computer could flag it as stolen. It is a chance to create a good stolen coin database that can identify coins even if they are removed from their holders. The question is whether or not PCGS will set up such a database.
Pillar of the Community
United States
5625 Posts
 Posted 03/26/2010  10:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Morgans Dad to your friends list
I have read and re-read the "Big one", in my opinion the system is Not set up for the collector.

I feel this is just another way of being fleeced by the big TPG'S, I have never been a big fan of slabbed coins, while I can see why some people would be.

I think Mr Hall, etal, should be ashamed of them selves for Not thinking of the collectors, who assisted his company in becoming what it is, instead, IMO, the company is trying more and more to "keep up with the Joneses", by that I mean another TPG also announced this "plus service", which to me, like stated earlier, is just another sign of the corporate milking of the collecting public and of course this will come at an extra cost to those seeking this service.

When the "CAC" sticker came out I only saw this as the TPG grading your coin, then another entity would also grade the coin to "be sure it is graded properly", which IMO, is a slap in the face of the 1st grading company, meaning why send our coins to be graded and then "just to be sure" ask for CAC to check it out also?. I would like to see the results of the coins that were submitted for the "CAC" sticker and did not receive it!!

I can only imagine what other services will be coming down the road, I for one will NOT be buying into this "smelly" service, I think you know what I mean.

I do know that their are those who will jump on this service for the extra indication on the slab and to them I would say, feed into the hype and enjoy spending your money! What was/is the purpose for submitting coins for a grade in the first place, to receive a grade and know that coin is authentic, do we really need another code or emblem on the slabs label?
In ending this post I would also like to add that I thought that this company already placed a "star" after a given grade to indicate a better quality grade on top of the already given grade.I could be wrong!!
Be well, just my opinion, Mike....
Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts
 Posted 03/27/2010  10:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bryan1315 to your friends list
looks like NGC is following suit with the Plus designation. The service will be available from NGC beginning in approximately 60-days. This is going to put the green football out of business because all they allowed was NGC and PCGS as far as I know. That service will be useless now

Quote:
It would allow the person that it was stolen from to send a list of the stolen coins to PCGS. Then if one of the stolen coins was cracked out and resubmitted the computer could flag it as stolen. It is a chance to create a good stolen coin database that can identify coins even if they are removed from their holders.

what if the person has Alzheimers and sells their coin and then weeks or months later starts looking through their coins and their list and see's one of their prized coins are gone and reports it stolen to PCGS and the new owner down the road think it is a lock for an upgrade and cracks it out and resubmits it to PCGS, will the guy he bought the coin from get the coin back?
Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts
 Posted 03/30/2010  11:04 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list
Submission of the serial numbers to PCGS would have to be accompanied by a police report listing the coins by serial number as being stolen. Yes I realize the hypothetical Alzheimer's patient may still report them as stolen and even report it to the police. Yes it could cause some problems, but I think in most cases it would be determined fairly quickly the coins were not stolen, and if it does also allow coins that have actually been stolen to be recovered I think it would be worth it.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts
 Posted 03/30/2010  12:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bryan1315 to your friends list
oh I agree I was just trying to see every hypothetical concern to see what would happen and also wanted to know what proof of the theft would be required to send to PCGS. I guess anyone with enough knowledge and money to purchase a high priced coin would know if they saw that yellow shield on the slab that no amount of resubmitting would result in a higher grade
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